MWL vs Regular plan vs Starch Solution

[MickeysBackyard]

Hi everyone! I'm going to be starting the McDougall program tomorrow and am excited to begin. What I haven't been able to decide is what "version" to follow. A little about me:

I'm a 40 year old female with no real health problems now other than being overweight (BMI is 28.5). I've been overweight for the majority of my life, and losing weight is not easy. I was raised to "take all you want but eat all you take" which hasn't been helpful I have a strong appetite and like big meals, but I also struggle with eating when I'm not hungry too . Heart disease and type 2 diabetes run in my family on both sides. I don't do a lot of strenuous exercise, but I do walk my dog at least 60 minutes per day and bike slowly with her in my handlebar basket for at least another 30 minutes (this will go up as our FL weather cools). I've also decided to start a couch-to-5k running program, although I'm certain I'll be a slow "penguin" runner and doubt it'll ever amount to strenuous exercise or longer distance running. I've had plantar fasciitis in the past, which if that flares up again will kill the running program dead. I should start stretching too, but I hate it. Baby steps.

So my question is this- with my age/background would you start with the Starch Solution or the regular McDougall program, or should I jump in with MWL? I think I've read that Dr. McDougall actually prefers the regular program because people are more satisfied with more starch, but I can't find that passage again. I tried Dr. Fuhrman's program in the past with success (about 10 years ago), but the thought of eating that many raw veggies again isn't appealing to me.

Any input is appreciated! Looking forward to getting to know you

[Daydream]

Welcome to the forum! Do the program you think you will have most success with but if I were you I would start with MWL. If that program is too difficult for you to stay on then you can try McDougall's regular program. This forum is very supportive if you have challenges you want to talk about and people can give you helpful tips for your success. I wish you all the best!

[Ltldogg]

Hi everyone! I'm going to be starting the McDougall program tomorrow and am excited to begin. What I haven't been able to decide is what "version" to follow. A little about me:

I'm a 40 year old female with no real health problems now other than being overweight (BMI is 28.5). I've been overweight for the majority of my life, and losing weight is not easy. I was raised to "take all you want but eat all you take" which hasn't been helpful I have a strong appetite and like big meals, but I also struggle with eating when I'm not hungry too . Heart disease and type 2 diabetes run in my family on both sides. I don't do a lot of strenuous exercise, but I do walk my dog at least 60 minutes per day and bike slowly with her in my handlebar basket for at least another 30 minutes (this will go up as our FL weather cools). I've also decided to start a couch-to-5k running program, although I'm certain I'll be a slow "penguin" runner and doubt it'll ever amount to strenuous exercise or longer distance running. I've had plantar fasciitis in the past, which if that flares up again will kill the running program dead. I should start stretching too, but I hate it. Baby steps.

So my question is this- with my age/background would you start with the Starch Solution or the regular McDougall program, or should I jump in with MWL? I think I've read that Dr. McDougall actually prefers the regular program because people are more satisfied with more starch, but I can't find that passage again. I tried Dr. Fuhrman's program in the past with success (about 10 years ago), but the thought of eating that many raw veggies again isn't appealing to me.

Any input is appreciated! Looking forward to getting to know you

Hi MickeysBackyard,

Welcome to the forums and to The McDougall Program. If you have not already, start here and read through "How To Begin" posts, in order:

viewforum.php?f=14

You might find your answer, but at a minimum you will learn a ton and have all the details you need to be successful.

Good luck,
Scott

[michaelswarm]

I agree with Ltldogg, that you should continue to explore all the Free Program resources. But also don't wait to get started as soon as possible. The difference between MWL and standard are not that significant. I would suggest focusing on finding a few favorite dishes that can become routines for breakfast, lunch and dinner, and focus on long term compliance. You can make adjustments as your practice and learning broadens and deepens.

Also important to be clear that heart disease and diabetes are not genetic, but dietary diseases, but I suspect you know that and just meant to say that it has happened in your family on both sides, for which I am sorry. My family also has experienced plenty of cardiovascular and related metabolic diseases on both sides. But their experience is not my destiny since I have taken control of my own plate.

What do you think caused you to abandon Dr Furhman's program?

Your current exercise sounds great. And congratulations on starting young.

[VeggieSue]

The McDougall Program *is* the Starch Solution. The MWLP is a slightly more restrictive version of the basic plan that Dr. McDougall first wrote about in 1978.

Do you have any of the McDougall books (he's written over a dozen)? The basic McDougall program is what's taught in all the books except the McDougall Program for Maximum Weight Loss. The Starch Solution book mentions the MWLP version of the program on page 216 in the section Achieving Maximum Weight Loss.

Which should you follow? Like others have said, it depends. With either version, you get a lot of starch to eat, but in MWLP it's all unprocessed - no pasta or bread. How do you do with fruit - are you satisfied with 1 or 2 pieces a day or do you tend to overeat? MWLP limits them to just 2 a day to prevent overeating it. Yes, Dr. McDougall has said to start with the basic plan and if you have a problem losing weight, use the restrictions of the MWLP.

You got tired of all the raw veggies on the nutritarian diet - you don't need to eat any on either version of the McDougall food plan, BUT if you have a problem losing weight it would help to eat more veggies, cooked or raw, and less starches. Dr. McD has been saying (in interviews) to make 90% of your plate a starch and use veggies like condiments to fill in the other 10%. In his books he says something like 75% starch to 25% veggies. In the MWLP book he mentions for those who have a really tough time losing weight they may want to bump the veggie part up to 50/50. The basic program is based on the principles of caloric density - things like veggies, fruit, complex carbs are less calories per pound than processed foods, meats and fats. Obviously, the more lower caloric density foods you eat - raw veg, cooked veg - the better your weight loss will be. Whether you follow the basic plan or the more restrictive MWLP version, each person is different as to how many of those lowest caloric density foods they need to eat to achieve the level of weight loss they're looking for. Aim for 1-2 pounds a week. Some people can get away with eating only 25% of their plate veggies 75% starch, but others need to bump it up to 50/50. Time will tell how much veggies you, yourself, will need.

BTW - love your user name and avatar. We lived in Kissimmee for one beautiful year and my dad lived in Kissimmee/St. Cloud for 17. We plan to go back to that area when hubby retires in a few years. We've had enough of winters in NJ.

[MickeysBackyard]

Thanks so much for your replies! Sounds like I'll start with MWL and see how I do with the 50/50 starch/veggie mix. I love vegetable soup and will make a huge pot today.

I read Dr. McDougall prefers to limit beans to an average of 1 cup/day, do people strictly adhere to that as well? If I go 50/50 on the starch/veggies and don't feel satisfied, would adding more starch always be preferrable to adding beans greater than 1 cup per day? A nice bowl of black bean soup could easily help me stay on plan, but I like including beans in my vegetable soup as well.

VeggieSue- special thanks to you for the detailed answer. I grew up in south Jersey and went to college at Rutgers in New Brunswick. I also did a 10 year "tour" of the Midwest once I got married before we ended up in GA, and then finally FL. I don't like the cold, but I absolutely can't handle the gray dull overcast winter skies of the east coast and Midwest. I remember as a kid flying home from a vacation over Thanksgiving to the PHL airport, seeing how gray and sad it looked outside, and asking my parents "Why do we live here?!?"

[VeggieSue]

I grew up in south Jersey

No wonder you chose Fuhrman first.

and went to college at Rutgers in New Brunswick.

My older brother went there back in the late 1960's, his ex-wife a Douglass gal.

I don't like the cold, but I absolutely can't handle the gray dull overcast winter skies of the east coast and Midwest.

The older I get, the more I dread those skies. It used to start around this time each year when I was younger, but the past decade or so the gloom starts right after the 4th of July, knowing the days are already getting shorter. That's when I start packing the hurricane/blizzard box (dried & canned food, cases of bottled water, batteries, etc.) for the next few seasons. We live in an urban city, and parking is scarce on a good weather day. Once the snow hits, we don't even try shovel the cars out - if we move out of the space we're in we won't find another one for a few weeks. At least we now have hubby's retirement and a return to the Land of the Mouse to look forward to. ºoº

[MickeysBackyard]

No wonder you chose Fuhrman first.

Haha!! Nah, he's just the one I found first and once I sipped the blended salad koolaid I didn't look anywhere else. He actually grates on my nerves slightly with his writing style- I remember him saying somewhere that no one could ever force him to eat a Dorito. Not to type-cast or anything, but the Italian Jersey girl in me wants to tie him up and make that happen

We live in an urban city, and parking is scarce on a good weather day.

Nope, I couldn't handle that. I feel like we suffer here in Orlando with a driveway and garage just about as narrow as can be to fit 2 cars side by side. I have to back my car in the garage so we can both park in there and still be able to get out (sniff, sniff!!). I remember when I first moved to a small town in south Georgia (the real south... interesting place), there were so many houses that didn't have sidewalks to their front porches or even driveways at all. The front porch just dumps you out on the grass, and people just park all over their lawn. It's funny how soon you get accustomed to that. It felt a little weird to move into a house in a neighborhood with an HOA where everything is so prim and proper again! But we move a lot, we're good chameleons.

[debknott]

Hi,

I think you would be better off starting with the regular McDougall eating plan as explained in the Starch Solution, whatever you weigh. The MLW plan is pretty restrictive and may discourage you. You are extremely likely to lose weight and start to feel better pretty quickly on the regular plan, and the transition to it is an easier one to make. Then later, if you feel your weight loss is too small, you can try switching to MLW and see how you do. I love the regular plan with its emphasis on starches, and it is the basis of all of Dr. McDougall's teaching.

Whatever you pursue I wish you great success! This is the best way to eat, and has helped so very many of us with countless health problems. And welcome to the McDougall forums!

Deborah

[MickeysBackyard]

Thanks for your input Deborah!! Excited to see how this goes. So far I've been doing MWL starch/veggie ratios but with a higher calorie density starch (I'm using rice). I'm going to see how I feel and will gladly "relax" to the Starch Solution guidelines if necessary. I've got a vacation coming up in a week, so having the less restrictive plan in my back pocket might make complaint bread etc feel like a fun treat (instead of being tempted with whatever junk food the other people we're traveling with will have)