Going well so far

[howardt]

Absolutely!

[howardt]

Could be. Restaurants probably ramped up the oil over time, the same way they've ramped up salt and sugar, to make food hyper palatable.

From inside the SAD bubble, I didn't noticed it. I guess I got used to it over time. I didn't start out that way. Growing up, the only source of oil was salad dressing. My mother didn't fry or sauté anything. Not for health reasons, she just didn't know how.

Before I switched to plant-based, other than boiling water, I never used the stove without oil or butter.

[howardt]

I think I have a disorder. According to a Dr. Steven Bratman, who made this up, Orthorexia Nervosa is an unhealthy obsession with healthy eating.

https://www.nationaleatingdisorders.org ... ia-nervosa
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... ssion.html

There were two quizzes. Let's see how I do:

Worried that your desire to eat clean has spiraled out of control? If you identify with two or more of the following traits, you may want to seek out a nutritionist or counselor, according to Dunn.

You consume a nutritionally unbalanced diet because of concerns about “food purity.”<No, my diet isn't unbalanced>

You’re preoccupied about how eating impure or unhealthy foods will affect your physical or emotional health.<Not sure what is meant by preoccupied, but I spend time every day planning and eating healthy meals, so yeah.>

You rigidly avoid any food you deem to be “unhealthy,” such as those containing fat, preservatives, additives or animal products.<I don't think I'm rigid, but I won't eat SAD if I can help it, and I sometimes go hungry to avoid it. So, yeah.>

You spend three or more hours per day reading about, acquiring or preparing certain kinds of food you believe to be “pure.”<This is the same as the first question, it just puts a time factor on it. 3 hours isn't out of the question, but not every day. I'll say yes to this one too.>

You feel guilty if you eat foods you believe to be “impure.”<No, I don't feel guilty, but I never feel good about it.>

You’re intolerant of other’s food beliefs.<Oh yeah. I hate food beliefs. I prefer food facts. I don't put down anyone's food, although sometimes I'll make it clear I think their food isn't healthy. I saw an article once with a headline that summed it up well: "I'm a vegetarian, not an a$$hole." I think this question means you are demonstrative in your intolerance, so I will say No.>

You spend an excessive proportion of your income on “pure” foods.<Nope, not at all. A $2 bag of dried beans lasts 5 or 6 meals. I guess salad and produce are relatively expensive, starches not.>

So, I had 3 yeses. I need a nutritionist or counselor I guess. The Daily Beast article said: "If you recognize any of the above behaviors in yourself, seeking the help of a medical professional should be your first step." Wow, who knew I was in such trouble. I thought I was doing good.

This is the other quiz:

Consider the following questions. The more questions you respond “yes” to, the more likely you are dealing with orthorexia.

Do you wish that occasionally you could just eat and not worry about food quality? <Of course>

Do you ever wish you could spend less time on food and more time living and loving? <A little, since my family enjoys a couple of meals a week at SAD restaurants. But I go along with them, and I don't miss any family time because of my diet. So I'd say No.>

Does it seem beyond your ability to eat a meal prepared with love by someone else – one single meal – and not try to control what is served?<Yes. Going to a restaurant, I'm limited by what's in the kitchen. Going to someone's house, they can prepare anything and they want to make something I will eat. It's the same when they come to my house, I don't serve fish to people who hate seafood. That's part of preparing food with love, you give a damn about the person you are serving it to.>

Are you constantly looking for ways foods are unhealthy for you?<Yes. That's a negative way of putting it, but I am constantly learning about the connection between food and health, and I make adjustments to my diet based on what I learn.>

Do love, joy, play and creativity take a back seat to following the perfect diet? <No.>

Do you feel guilt or self-loathing when you stray from your diet? <No, this question was in the last quiz but the "self-loathing" qualification was missing. That doesn't apply to me. I do feel better about myself when I am compliant, because I know compliance is why I am healthier than I was before I started.>

Do you feel in control when you stick to the “correct” diet? <Absolutely.>

Have you put yourself on a nutritional pedestal and wonder how others can possibly eat the foods they eat? <I don't like to think I'm on a pedestal. If I were an ethical vegan, maybe I would feel I am better than meat eaters. But I don't think I deserve any awards for eating well. Instead I feel bad for people who are trapped in their unhealth, and mistakenly think that "eat less, exercise more" is going to help them. So I'd say No to this one."

So that's 4 yesses.

I am sick, sick, sick.

Not really. There are extremes to everything and if you follow any philosophy to the point where you cut yourself off from your friends and family, and are always unhappy, then there is a problem. That doesn't describe me, even if these silly quizzes do.

[Nean]

I've seen orthorexia as a label before. And I've witnessed some folks who are OCD about food and food cleanliness etc. But I usually dismiss this new label as a way for conventional SAD eaters to dismiss those of us who they feel are extreme in our food beliefs. And if we are sick with some new 'exia, they don't have to listen to a thing we say and therefore don't have to look at their own behaviors.
(Of course, McDougallers are right about their food choices and the rabid Paleo folks are dead wrong, but that's a whole nother topic )

[howardt]

But I usually dismiss this new label as a way for conventional SAD eaters to dismiss those of us who they feel are extreme in our food beliefs. And if we are sick with some new 'exia, they don't have to listen to a thing we say and therefore don't have to look at their own behaviors.

Right. I haven't heard of a new "rexia" for people who know beef is heart attack food but "can't" quit.

[howardt]

Right Lynn. So many people I've met want to change their diet. Not to WFPB, but just less junk food, and they say they "can't". The lure is too strong, it's too convenient, they "crave" it, yadda yadda. "Compulsive" describes it well.

[Nean]

Maybe it's just a different kind of easy, but for me it is far easier to have my green light, unlimited foods be anything that looks like it did when the farmer touched it, my yellow lights be a very few made items just a step or so away from the farmer and anything else is red light, not on the list, can't be justified. I don't always stick to my own goals, but it sure makes grocery shopping less stressful.

[howardt]

I've been on a WFPBNO plan for 18 months, since May 2013. For the first 17 months or so, my weight either dropped or plateaued over that period, from a start of 210 to a low of 144. After feeling occasional weakness in my legs from time to time, I decided to increase my calorie intake by increasing the amount of starch in my diet.

I eat a larger portion of oatmeal in the morning, added an extra chapati or tortilla here and there, shifted from salad & fruit at lunch to steamed vegetables & rice (sometimes white rice), started eating fewer sweet potatoes and more yukon golds, started eating corn grits as an evening snack instead of carrots & celery, and my weight loss subsided. However, for the last month I've been gaining weight. These diet changes have been easy to do - who doesn't want to eat more starch?

So, for the first time since I started this plan my weight is rising. I feel good, no more weakness. I've gained 4 lbs or so. My weight is between 148 and 149, my bmi is 21. I was starting to think there was no way to gain weight on a plant based diet, but I guess not.

My initial reaction was concern, but now I'm not sure. I have a decision to make. I can probably go back to 144 by reversing myself, raising the low calorie dense foods in my diet, and reducing the starch, especially the white rice and white potatoes. But aside from the weight gain trajectory, I'm happy with the food I eat now.

For now I'll just wait and see. If I keep going up and hit 150 I'll have to go back to the old menu. I don't want to reverse all the progress I've made, and for sure don't want to buy new clothes again. I finally donated all my fat clothes. I think I'll make a couple of easy changes. No more white rice and yukons, less refined starch, and back to carrots & celery at night. We'll see how that goes.

[howardt]

Been a long time between posts.

Figured I'd post on what it's like to turn success into failure.

I'd been plant-based for 2.5 years as of last Thanksgiving (2015). Up to that point I had been nearly fully compliant. But I just got sick of it all, sick of the hassle of making every meal from scratch, sick of every restaurant decision involving my personal diet, sick of people making a big deal over what I eat or didn't eat.

So I went off plan. And no surprise I put back most of the weight. Frankly it is a surprise I haven't put back all of it, but I gained 50 of the 60 pounds I lost.

Not being plant based has been such a relief. Food is everywhere now. I eat what everyone else eats. I don't have to rule out restaurants, or go hungry while everyone else eats. No one fusses over me. I don't have to explain anything. I don't threaten anyone. I don't set an example for anyone this way, but no one followed my example while I ate plant-based anyway.

The health issues I had before I started the plant-based diet have not returned. I feel fine, except I'm fat. I don't like the way I look and my clothes are all too tight.

But having succeeded once, at least I know how to do it again. I plan to go back to plant-based beginning next Monday. But a lot of the food I ate, and enjoyed when I was plant-based last time are really unappetizing now. I don't understand it, but I used to eat oatmeal and bananas every day. Now I can't even look at either one. My stomach turns at the idea of eating lots of leafy greens again, or brown rice, or plain baked potato.

I'm going to take this week to figure out what the hell I am going to eat, and then go back. I really don't know how I'm going to deal with the parts of the plan that made it hard to follow last time - having people make a big deal over what I eat.

I have to figure out how to have a better attitude. The last time I was overjoyed to eat different and get healthier, because I felt so terrible eating SAD. This time I don't have the same motivation. I feel OK, I just don't want to look the way I look any more. But honestly if there were a way to eat SAD and not gain weight I'd do it instead.

I used to be proud of my weight, and ability to maintain it eating plant-based. Seems a stupid thing to be proud of, but it's true. I've lost that, and I want it back. So back to plant-based it is.

[calvin]

So, you're bumping this thread to tell us you bumped your weight. Now that's a novel testimonial. At least you can gain if you want to - I can't so I'm kind of envious...er...i think.

[howardt]

Yeah, for me all I do is eat "normal" and pounds magically melt on.

[viv]

Welcome back! You have done it before so you can do it again. Because things seem different this time and your motivation etc. has changed maybe you can contact Doug Lisle our psychologist for some insights on the best way to proceed. Good luck! Viv

[howardt]

Thanks Viv.

Your picture looks great! Congratulations on doing so well on the plan.