Cheating

[Mom+Me]

I appreciate all your advice. The holidays are rough and traveling is really difficult. When I don't stick to the plan I hit the workout facility where I am and burn off 300 calories or so. Is that a solution? No, but it's better than doing nothing. I figure if I stick to the starch solution for 95% of the time and am still much better off than if I hadn't. And then I look how most people eat and realize I shouldn't feel too bad. Life is full of compromises, unfortunately.

Since it seems that one of your biggest problems with possible deviation is when you're traveling, there are healthier choices available than Cliff bars. As f1jim said, some are really bad, others are not as bad, but still not good. There's a bar called "That's It" https://thatsitfruit.com/fruit-bars/ and also most Larabars https://www.larabar.com/our-products/larabar would be McDougall Plan approved, though they are concentrated by usually having dates and nuts. Be careful, some of the Larabars have coconut and oil.

Other options are packets of plain oatmeal that you can eat dry with a banana and glass of water, aseptic packages of beans, soup, etc., and containers of already cooked rice, though many contain oil. If you do a search, you can find topics like this that have been covered.

It sounds like you're doing really well, though. The biggest thing is to not "beat yourself up" and to stay as close to on-plan as possible, which it seems you are already doing--great job!!

[figlover]

Dr. Longo's L-Nutra fast bar is probably one of the least unhealthy out there.

Mostly nuts and honey for sweetness. Could just eat a few nuts and an orange. Like you really need a premade bar with other crap in it?
Don't mind me, I'm an outlier here.

[jester]

Yes, if you burn off the extra calories you ate you won’t gain weight.

Thanks. I appreciate your direct answer.
I wish I had the iron will that most here have, but I don't. Every now and then I veer off-course.

Unfortunately the answer isn't all that straightforward. From a pure thermodynamics point of view this is true; however, the body is such a complex system that this isn't the whole story. As someone mentioned above, the increased workout could cause an increase in hunger, and you may end up eating another Cliff bar later on. Or you may just subconsciously eat a larger portion of food at a subsequent meal. There is also some research to suggest that your body may down-regulate other autonomic nervous system processes to compensate for the increased energy expenditure, thereby nullifying the calories burned (to some extent anyway). You can google for Herman Pontzer's research on the Hadza hunter-gatherers if you're interested in more information - fascinating stuff.

Anyway, as someone else noted, if you're biggest transgression is an occasional Cliff bar, it's probably not going to greatly impact your weight loss. Just wanted to point out that the answer may not be as simple, or clear cut, as it seems it should be.

[DenverGuy]

Mom+Me, well said. Thanks.
Jester, I get the impression that with small possible deviation, it basically is calories in, calories out.
I will read up, per your suggestion.
I don't know why folks mentioned eating again after the workout. It's common sense that that would negate the workout's calorie burn.

[gracezw]

The reason why as I see it is that you did not rule out up front "eating again after the workout." So it could go both ways, and it did.

I don't know why folks mentioned eating again after the workout. It's common sense that that would negate the workout's calorie burn.

[landog]

Don't kid yourselves.
Cheating could easily kill you.

[JeffN]

I was recently sent the links to these 4 blogs by Brand New Vegan (Chuck Underwood), who used to post here. I think they would add to this discussion.

HOW I CURED MY HYPERTENSION IN 30 DAYS WITHOUT DIETING
https://www.brandnewvegan.com/articles/ ... ut-dieting

HOW MY PLANT-BASED DIET SAVED MY LIFE
https://www.brandnewvegan.com/articles/ ... ed-my-life

AFTER THE STROKE
https://www.brandnewvegan.com/articles/after-the-stroke

SELF-CARE AFTER A STROKE
https://www.brandnewvegan.com/articles/ ... r-a-stroke

I think they are of value to read and there is a message in them, that we hear and see often here and at the 10-Day Program.

I don't know Chuck well, we have only communicated a few times and so I do not know any details other then what he has shared. He said he was planning to come to the March 10-Day, which was cancelled, so sadly, that never happened as we would have met there.

Chuck had a stroke. From his own words in the first link...

I know some of you might be asking, “But Chuck. You were already eating a Whole Food, Plant-Based Diet? And you’re right. I was. For the most part, I was pretty much living on the recipes I post here to this blog.

As I said “for the most part” – like maybe 99% of the time.

But that other 1%…..

I was also including things in my diet that I shouldn’t have. Maybe not a lot, maybe not very often, but nevertheless, things I should have removed from my diet a long time ago.

Below is a list of what I removed.

Some of you won’t like it. Some of you will argue. Whatever. This is exactly what I removed from my diet.

The only thing I changed!

And I now have the scale readings and blood pressure numbers to prove it made a difference.

* Nuts – Yes, even cashew sauces
* Seeds – With the exception of Flax on my oatmeal
* Nut butter – No Peanut Butter, and PBJs were my favorite snack.
* Seed butter – No Tahini
* Vegan butter – It was rare – but occasionally I’d have it on my toast
* Veganaise – Again – this was rare but now it’s gone completely
* Beer & Wine – Nothing but calories
* Vegan cheese – My wife likes it – so it was always in my fridge
* Tofu – Good for you sure, but it IS calorie-dense
* Restaurants – once a week my guilty pleasure was a trip to my favorite Mexican Restaurant for Vegan Burritos & Margaritas. Can you say salt, oil, and sugar? No more.
* Veggie Burgers & Fries – Again if it’s from a restaurant – it’s guaranteed to be full of grease. Even those Impossible or Beyond things in the store – avoid them like you would this virus if you want to lose weight.
* Store-bought Hummus – because oil = fat = calories. Make your own.
* Plant-based milk, yogurt, sour cream – lots of fat and calories.
* Avocados – yep them too. Too high in fat.

Since he was not able to go to the 10-Day, he did a home-based program himself.

The results?

From the 4th link

I did everything at home – that I knew I would have been doing in Santa Rosa.

I drank lots of water
I exercised a minimum of 30 minutes a day
I made sure I got 8 hrs of sleep every night
I turned off the news so I wouldn’t stress
And I ate a whole-foods, starch-based diet

I have lost nearly 20 lbs
My blood pressure is now normal
I now take NO medications of any kind

What I found most interesting, based on his comments, is that whatever degree of adherence he had, it may not have been enough. What, if any, it contributed to his stroke, I don't know. Yes, there are other factors that play a role other then diet and exercise, however, excess weight, inactivity, high blood pressure, high cholesterol and a diet high in fat and salt are all risk factors. Even if you are vegan.

As I have said, we see this quite often at the program. People come who are overweight, obese, with high blood pressure, high blood sugar, high cholesterol and are on medications. They tell us they do not understand because they are vegan and/or WFPB and even follow the McDougall diet. Yet, in 10-Days with only changing the food and mixing in a little activity, they experience dramatic changes in their health.

We heard a similar story 2 years ago from Landog. As he posted above....

Don't kid yourselves.
Cheating could easily kill you.

Change is not easy. The Pleasure Trap is real. The solution is time and adherence.

I wish Chuck the best and continued health.

In Health
Jeff

[gracezw]

Jeff, thank you for posting this! A powerful real case! Thanks

[Ltldogg]

If you think Brand New Vegan was 99% complaint, I have some great swamp land to sell you!!!

Seriously, people lie, exaggerate and "forget" ALL the time. I'm guessing he was about 75% complaint. I've said it before and I'll say it again. IF YOU WANT TO BE HEALTHY, YOU HAVE TO DO HEALTHY. It's as simple as that. You have to follow a healthy diet as prescribed here by Jeff and John. Strive to be 100% complaint. I see people every single day on these forums writing in their journals who just don't get it and they just don't see the results. You have to set yourself up for success in advance by removing the bad and stocking up on the good, then not allowing yourself to slip nor making excuses. That bit of bad food didn't magically put itself in your mouth. YOU PUT IT THERE. Stop with the excuses.

Also, you don't get to interpret the McDougall Program to your liking and then still say you are McDougall compliant, because you are not. This is a huge point that has to be made as I see it ALL THE TIME on these forums.

[Tom Dylan]

Greetings from North Carolina,


It has been a long time since I have been on this forum, and this was EXACTLY what I needed to read. This morning I decided that enough is enough. I'm back on board with McDougall Diet. Not 95%, but 100%.

I lost about 80lbs back in 2012, and have been strictly vegan since. For a long time, I was gung ho and close to 100% compliant. I felt great.

It starts with thinking a little won't hurt, but we really do kid ourselves. We may say we're 95% compliant, but if you write it all down and add it up, the deception becomes clear.

After Covid 19 hit, my steady decline only accelerated. Fortunately, I haven't gained all 80lbs back. But I've come to accept blood pressure meds as part of my day. Recently, I've developed GI issues that are probably ulcers. My GI doc has me on Nexium. Since Covid 19 hit, I put on an extra 20lbs. I've indulged in any number of vegan junk foods trying to comfort myself during this unprecedented crisis.

So I finally braved the scale this morning, and it looks like I've gained back 40lbs of the 80lbs I lost. If I keep this up, it will easily be me with a stroke.

I'm done with excuses. I want my health back, and I'm committing to this 100% today.

[JeffN]

It’s been a year and here is a follow up to BNV’s story.

https://www.brandnewvegan.com/articles/the-new-normal

He regained all of the weight back and had do to a “weight loss challenge” again. Lose 21 lbs in 21 days.

This is why I am not a fan of “tweets, “challenges” etc etc.

Well, not true. I am a big fan of one challenge… the “every day, day in and day out adherence” challenge


In Health
Jeff

[Mom+Me]

If you think Brand New Vegan was 99% complaint, I have some great swamp land to sell you!!!

Seriously, people lie, exaggerate and "forget" ALL the time. I'm guessing he was about 75% complaint. I've said it before and I'll say it again. IF YOU WANT TO BE HEALTHY, YOU HAVE TO DO HEALTHY. It's as simple as that. You have to follow a healthy diet as prescribed here by Jeff and John. Strive to be 100% complaint. I see people every single day on these forums writing in their journals who just don't get it and they just don't see the results. You have to set yourself up for success in advance by removing the bad and stocking up on the good, then not allowing yourself to slip nor making excuses. That bit of bad food didn't magically put itself in your mouth. YOU PUT IT THERE. Stop with the excuses.

Also, you don't get to interpret the McDougall Program to your liking and then still say you are McDougall compliant, because you are not. This is a huge point that has to be made as I see it ALL THE TIME on these forums.

Ltldogg, I remember having read your post shortly after you wrote it and thought it was so good and so true. I didn't comment then, but after I just read it again now, I thought I'd take the time to thank you for writing it; it's timeless! Hoping more people will read and follow what you said.

[Mom+Me]

Greetings from North Carolina,


It has been a long time since I have been on this forum, and this was EXACTLY what I needed to read. This morning I decided that enough is enough. I'm back on board with McDougall Diet. Not 95%, but 100%.

I lost about 80lbs back in 2012, and have been strictly vegan since. For a long time, I was gung ho and close to 100% compliant. I felt great.

It starts with thinking a little won't hurt, but we really do kid ourselves. We may say we're 95% compliant, but if you write it all down and add it up, the deception becomes clear.

After Covid 19 hit, my steady decline only accelerated. Fortunately, I haven't gained all 80lbs back. But I've come to accept blood pressure meds as part of my day. Recently, I've developed GI issues that are probably ulcers. My GI doc has me on Nexium. Since Covid 19 hit, I put on an extra 20lbs. I've indulged in any number of vegan junk foods trying to comfort myself during this unprecedented crisis.

So I finally braved the scale this morning, and it looks like I've gained back 40lbs of the 80lbs I lost. If I keep this up, it will easily be me with a stroke.

I'm done with excuses. I want my health back, and I'm committing to this 100% today.

Tom Dylan, thank you for sharing your experience. It's not fun fessing up, but it's good for us and good for others to know that they're not the only one dealing with not following the McDougall Plan 100%. How are you doing now?

[Mom+Me]

It’s been a year and here is a follow up to BNV’s story.

https://www.brandnewvegan.com/articles/the-new-normal

He regained all of the weight back and had do to a “weight loss challenge” again. Lose 21 lbs in 21 days.

This is why I am not a fan of “tweets, “challenges” etc etc.

Well, not true. I am a big fan of one challenge… the “every day, day in and day out adherence” challenge


In Health
Jeff

Jeff, thank you for drawing our attention to this! I always appreciate how you update all sorts of topics on the Discussion Board...sometimes even when years have passed; it's awesome!

Wow, what a sad reality of how people can and do fall off the bandwagon...even when they're out there with a website, YouTube channel, etc. and have had a medical catastrophe...in this case, Chuck with his stroke last year.

Please know that I am in no way pointing fingers. None of us is perfect. What's important is that--when we do fall--we get up as quickly as possible, dust ourselves off, and move as far away as we can from whatever it is that caused us to fall. I commend Chuck for baring his soul/experiences. May he have continued success and not need any more "challenges" because he'll continue to be compliant day in and day out.