Discussion Board

Bob posted a response on this in another thread and I was wondering if you are familiar with it. I sometimes use this when I don't want to make my own. Are they rounding down the numbers by weight?

http://www.nasoya.com/nasoya/nayonaise_fatfree.html

what are your thoughts on this? I really don't care for the taste but sometimes use it when I don't want to make the tofu mayo or other recipes from scratch.

Not Jeff, but the numbers are rounded down. Soymilk is the first ingredient, so there is definitely a significant amount of fat for the calories in there.

Jeff,
To spare you the effort of looking, here was my post in the other thread about this zero fat product. Have I earned my merit badge in label reading, or am I being too hard on this product?
====================

I don't buy this product, but I did look at the label. It was hard for me to believe that something advertised as a substitute for mayonnaise was truly free of all fats.

I would like somebody to pose the question to Jeff about the label. I won't since I am not interested in the product.

But the serving size is 15 grams, yet it has zero grams of fat, 2 grams of carbs, and less than a gram of protein. Where are the rest of the grams? I expect that they are using the "water weight" trick to get the serving size down to where they can list the fat as zero.

Most likely, the fat is right at .5 grams in what is really about a sub- 4 gram serving of real food. Since they advertise the food as zero fat (which it clearly isn't since soybeans are the first ingredient in the label) there is no way to tell. Soybeans run 40-50 per cent calories from fat. The firsts three ingredients are soybeans, sugar (i.e. evaporated cane juice) and corn starch (even more "sugar"). This sounds like a food disaster to me - certainly not a low fat choice.

And as Jeff has talked about, people consider that there is no fat, so why not use lots. Then, how come those cholesterol numbers won't go down - must be stubborn cholesterol or something genetic. This is a food label from which you really can't tell a lot, but most of the calories have to be coming from fat and sugar. I am thinking that this is a junk food, but you can't really tell much from the label when they minimize the serving size so much that you can't really tell. All you can do is look at the ingredients - (processed?) soybeans, sugar, corn starch . . . . No thanks.

Yes, you get your "merit badge" in label reading (as does cubby2112)

You have pointed out several of the main problems with products like this...

- the label is clearly not accurate as it clearly does not represent the ingredients, let alone the main ingredient. If the serving size is 15 grams and it has 2 grams of sugar and about 1 gram of protein, we are missing 12 grams. So, the water has to make up most of it, which is being thickened by the Xanthan gum and diluting out the fat in the soybeans so it can be rounded down. In addition, they add all the salt to add some flavor to the dilution.

- it fails the sodium guidelines by far.

- the tendency for many people is to believe these numbers are 100% accurate and look at these products as either "OK", "acceptable", or "healthy" and use way more than they should.

I would not recommend this product.

Thanks for your help and great job!

In Health
Jeff

what would you recommend for using for mayonaise?

guess I flunked the label reading on this one (the Nasoys)...I am curious also what you would recommend. Mayo made with tofu still has fat, but the sodium would be better I guess. Need to try the potato one I found. I have made the tofu mayo from the cookbooks but still don't like it much.

I, too, have been using the Nasoya Fat Free mayo since I started the diet ( I use it in potato salad). I am interested in hearing what others recommend as a lower fat alternative. Best, Gail

I'm the one who started that thread looking for a "fat free" mayo. As it was called in one of the recipes in the 12 day plan on here, for a sandwich spread. It calls for 1/4 cup and makes 4 servings. I'm confused that it would call for "fat free" mayonnaise if all mayo is going to have some fat in it.

Does anyone understand this?

This is the recipe:

Savory Sandwiches
Servings: 4
Preparation Time: 15 minutes
Chilling time: 1 hour

Make the spread early to allow it to chill.

Spread:
1 15 ounce can garbanzo beans, drained and rinsed
1/2 cup finely chopped celery
1/4 cup finely chopped sweet onion
1/4 cup finely chopped green onions
2 tablespoons sweet or dill pickle relish
1 tablespoon lemon juice
1/4 cup fat-free mayonnaise


8 slices whole wheat bread
lettuce
tomatoes
mustard

Mash beans with a bean masher. Place in a bowl and add celery, onions, relish, lemon juice and fat-free mayonnaise. Mix well. Chill to blend flavors.

Spread bread with mustard, if desired. Place about 1/2 cup of the spread on four of the bread slices. Add lettuce, tomatoes, close up and eat.

from the dec 2007 newsletter:

Hint: Tofu Mayonnaise is made with a package of soft silken tofu, 1 ½ tablespoons lemon juice, 1 teaspoon sugar, ½ teaspoon salt, ½ teaspoon dry mustard, ⅛ teaspoon white pepper. Place all ingredients in a food processor and process until smooth. Make this ahead of time for best results.

I have made various version of this and used it for these salads. There are some similar ones in the cookbooks...hope this helps. I just don't always remember to make it in advance!

Nasoya makes a fat-free version of Nayonaise which contains only soymilk (water, org. whole soybeans), cane juice, corn starch, distilled vinegar, salt, xanthan gum, mustard seed, lemon juice concentrate, onion powder, garlic juice, natural flavor, spices.

Other than the soymilk and mustard seed, I can't see where any fat would come from. There's certainly no added fat in this product, and I believe this is the one Mary McD uses.

Nettie

Nettie, the "fat free" Nayonaise is the product that Jeff and I were talking about. The label is quite deceptive IMO. You can read my post above.

Does this math work for any product or only condiment type stuff? I am not good at math, but I really understand this thread for some reason, and now all the stuff I have read/heard from you Jeff now makes sense. And someone else said that mustard has fat, but in all my types/brands I have found no fat, added or otherwise. Is there fat in mustard??

Thank you
Deb

I appreciate your comments.

Let me clarify what may be a very important issue..

There is not one "McDougall Program" but principles and guidelines that we have to apply based on someones personal health issues and of course, their own lifestyle and preferences. The program always has to be adapted to the individual and their specific situation.

It is also important to understand the nature of "scientific discourse". If you put 12 scientists in a room with a recent research paper that they may all agree on the basic premise of, they will come up with 12 similar but somewhat different opinions of the research and how to best apply it.

As, I have also said before...

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=14076

"One of the great things about the professional team Dr McDougall has now put together is that all us and all of our individual messages and information supports each other and the bigger picture we all deliver"

This is true, even if we do not agree 100% on everything, as it is what makes us all better at what we do.

As I often say here in this forum, my recommendations for most people who have not achieved their health goals yet, is to follow the recommendations of the MWL program. It is not just for weight and it is the most effective program and has the clearest definitions of what is approved and what isn't. All of this is important for anyone who is not where they want to be yet.

As I wrote about a year ago in this thread, on

viewtopic.php?t=8316

One of the main reasons for not being successful that I listed was ...

"Not understanding the difference between something that is "allowed" on occasion in small quantities, and something that is "recommended."

My personal and professional experience over the last 2 1/2 decades of helping people achieve their health goals is that the simpler and easier they keep the program and its definitions, the better.

Variety vs Simplicity: The Key to Success
viewtopic.php?t=8179

In addition, the less the use of processed and refined foods, the better. And, most importantly the more the limit (or avoidance) of any food product that should be limited, the better. Many people find that if they do use these products, it becomes difficult for them to limit their use and the use of them encourages their over consumption of other foods that are not in their best interest and therefore, avoiding them in the first place, is their best approach. I hear this time and time again, even in this forum and on these boards.

Items like nuts, soy, juice and sugar are also "allowed' on the program but for many people they would not be recommended or even advisable to consume at all.

If someone is successful and the program is working for them however they are defining it, then I only wish them the best and continued success.

However, if they are struggling with achieving their goals, then they may want to "tighten up the belt" in regard to what is "allowed" and what is "recommended."

In Health
Jeff

It is hard to say without seeing the specific product as the industry uses different "tricks" on different products.



Thanks.



Remember..

1) all plant foods have fat.

2) this is not a fat-free program,

3) Mustard comes from the mustard "seed" and like any seed, mustard seed does have fat.

4) mustard is a condiment so if you use it, think of it as such.

In Health
Jeff