Fasting blood sugar stuck at high level

[starchette]

Greetings! I'm new here but I'm not new to the McDougall program. I bought the book in 1990 (in my 20's) and followed the plan for about 5 years before unfortunately straying into a high-fat lacto-ovo vegetarian diet. About 4 years ago I was diagnosed with type 2 diabetes so here I am again on the WFPB way of eating.

Thus far I have managed to stay off meds, but this past summer I got lazy and ate too many fats including some dairy fats. One morning I tested my blood glucose and it was over 200. In the past, when my numbers escalated (usually around 120-150) I could easily lower them with diet within a few days. However, this time, the numbers won't budge. I've lost 10 pounds and my BMI is normal* but my fasting BG hovers around 240, sometimes higher.

I've been pretty strictly following the diet, eating very low fat, for at least 1 month, probably closer to 2 months. If I remember correctly, Dr. McDougall says that fasting BG from 150-350 is acceptable, but shouldn't it be going down as I continue the diet? How long should I continue before calling my doctor to get on meds?

*I'm one of those thinner diabetics-- 5', 120 lbs, female 55 years old.

Thanks in advance for any advice or ideas!

[VeggieSue]

People can better help you if you post a 3 day food diary, listing everything that passes your lips that you eat or drink. We may see something that you're having a problem with.

Also, note what kind of exercise you're doing.

[Lyndzie]

Hi. I just happened across this post and thought that maybe it would be helpful (I peruse the old threads on occasion). Specifically:

However, while we can change the diet in someone immediately, we can not reverse the IR immediately and for some there is a transition period while the IR reverses. In some folks it is almost immediate and in some may takes days, weeks or even a few months.

As I did say, in my experience in working with 1000's of these patients over the years, about 25% of them are very sensitive to fruit and processed carbs, even whole grain flour products and their "numbers" look better when they remove these foods or restrict them "until" the IR is reversed or mostly reversed. In these people, we see elevated TGs, insulin and blood sugars during this time and when we remove the fruit or other foods, these numbers go down.

Good luck!

[starchette]

Thank you! I generally avoid refined carbs such as white bread, pasta, and white rice. But I have continued to eat fruit because it never affected me before (that is, before my FBG got "stuck"). But lately I have been wondering if the fruit is aggravating the situation.

As requested, I'm going to post my diet for a few days:

Today:
FBG 268 - So no breakfast until a couple of hours later
Coffee
Breakfast: 2 medium apples
Green tea (sipped 2 cups throughout the day)
Lunch: a large bowl with equal parts corn and non-starchy veggies, seasoned with tamari soy sauce, garlic, onion, and vinegar.
*Edited to add that the veggies were: cauliflower, mushrooms, green beans, and carrots. So I guess there was a bit more starch than I previously recalled.
Dinner: 2 cups quinoa seasoned same as lunch (no veggies)
Turmeric and cinnamon tea with unsweetened soy milk (probably about 2 tbsp)

No scheduled exercise but I walked 1.3 miles which is my usual daily amount of walking.

[openmind]

Great catch Lyndzie!

[Lyndzie]

Thanks, openmind!

I am no diabetes expert by all means, but if I recall correctly post-meal exercise helps increase insulin sensitivity. Could you go for a 15 min walk after a meal (or two or three)? Theoretically that would get the sugar out of the blood and into the muscles, where is belongs.

[starchette]

I am no diabetes expert by all means, but if I recall correctly post-meal exercise helps increase insulin sensitivity. Could you go for a 15 min walk after a meal (or two or three)? Theoretically that would get the sugar out of the blood and into the muscles, where is belongs.

I think you are probably right. I am trying to figure out a way to make time to exercise more. It's easy on the weekends, but not so much on weekdays. Exercise is another area that in the past didn't seem to affect my blood sugar, but maybe that has changed.

The comments here are helping me to take a fresh look at my habits. I am wrapping my mind around the fact that my diabetes isn't going to be as easy to manage as it used to be.

Day 2 food diary:

FBG 334 (ugh!) so no breakfast today. I guess I might be sensitive to quinoa, or maybe the corn that I had at lunch. Those are the only two things I ate that were different from my usual meals. I don't think I've ever had a fasting number that high.
I also lost another 2 lbs; I'm down to 118. (BMI normal at 23)

Lunch: a large bowl half full of corn (again), the other half was cauliflower and butternut squash. Seasoned as usual (see previous log).

Dinner: Lunch was not enough food, so I became very hungry at work and bought an early afternoon takeout dinner: lettuce wrap (no flour, just lettuce) filled with avocado, cucumber, mushrooms, onions, bell peppers, and dijon mustard. Normally I would avoid avocado, but it was either that or something processed.

For the next week or so I'm going to cut back on fruit and grains, and have more beans, and see if that helps.

[starchette]

*I forgot to mention that I drank a cup of coffee in the morning and sipped green tea throughout the day (probably 3-4 cups).

* And walked 1.6 miles.

[starchette]

Day 3 food diary:

FBG: 180 - Much better, probably because I had fasted 17 hours since dinner the day before.

Breakfast:
Coffee
1 cup oatmeal (uncooked) with 1 oz raisins and unsweetened almond milk (eaten as cold cereal).

Lunch: I went out to eat but was able to get something not-terrible:
Vegetable miso soup (broth) with broccoli, cabbage, carrots, celery, mushrooms, rice noodles, and brown rice. I'm pretty sure the soup had a small amount of oil in it. I don't think the rice was made with oil.
I drank water with lunch.

Lunch was followed immediately by a long walk (4.4 miles)

Snack: 1 mango

Dinner: 2 cups hummus without added fat or oil.

Tomorrow is grocery shopping day. I've decided to stop buying fruit until I see a clear turnaround in my insulin resistance reflected in my daily FBG tests. (And this will probably motivate me to figure out how to exercise more regularly.)

This is my last daily food diary but I'll continue to work on this and post updates in the future. I know I'm not the only person in this situation and it really helps to hear about the experiences of others whose numbers don't change as quickly as we would like.

EDITED to update the next morning's FBG: 227 - this is typical for the last several weeks.

[VeggieSue]

First off, get EVERY trace of fat out of your diet! If something has oil in it, don't eat it! It's better to go a bit hungry rather than eat something with oil!

Read Dr. McDougall's writings on diabetes right here on this web site:

https://www.google.com/search?q=diabete ... ougall.com

Be diligent in avoiding foods high in fat. Yes, it's better to skip that avocado in your wrap and just load up on more veggies. Avoid the soup with oil at that restaurant, make your own hummus and skip the store bought ones with tahini (or the sesame seeds that Engine 2 brand adds instead of tahini directly), not just avoiding oil on the label. Avoid coffee - it damages the arteries, and as a diabetic, your arteries are already being damaged enough. Coffee isn't a part of the McDougall program for anyone.

Follow the Maximum Weight Loss version of the McDougall food plan. That one allows less processed foods, less foods higher in fat, like nuts, seeds, tofu, and avocados, and restricts fruits to only 2 per day. Don't skip meals, and make sure you eat a healthy starch with each one - don't bombard your system with an all-fruit breakfast when you know your blood sugar is already high. Dr. McDougall also said it's better to east many smaller meals than 3 large ones to keep blood sugar at a steady level instead of 3 highs per day.

One phrase that has been said frequently on these forums - time and perseverance. Don't expect instant results - you didn't become diabetic overnight and it won't go away overnight. Just stay the course and things will improve.

[openmind]

also remember the glucometer itself could be inaccurate. Jeff posted recently about this.

[starchette]

Thanks, Veggie Sue.

Yeah, In the past I've always bounced back very quickly from setbacks where I allowed my blood sugar to get above normal. This time, something has changed, it's much higher than ever and not bouncing back, and that's what I'm trying to figure out. I'm very thankful to all who have highlighted parts of the program wherein I've previously been able to bend the rules without consequences.

It's helpful to know that it can take more time than I've assumed. That's the main reason I posted here. I felt like I had already gone for a long time without results. Now I realize that not only can it take more time than I assumed, but I was also fooling myself into thinking that I was "strictly" following the plan.

The three days that I journaled were not typical for me, but they were real as far as they demonstrate what happens when things don't go as planned.

What I've learned:
- I should cut out the fruit for a while and see if that helps.
- I need to improve my meal-planning skills so that I don't end up eating things I didn't plan to eat.
- I need to exercise more. (After-meal walks aren't always feasible, so I'm going to try some at-home workout videos.)

I am familiar with the MWL but I haven't ever tried to follow it. (I've never needed to lose much weight, and I've always failed at regimented diets with meal plans, etc.) But today I'll be looking at the foods used in the recipes and my plan is to limit myself to those foods for the next 2 weeks and see if that changes anything.

Thanks again. I'm glad I posted here. You all are so helpful and generous with your knowledge.

[starchette]

also remember the glucometer itself could be inaccurate. Jeff posted recently about this.

Yes, in fact, I had considered that and I will be buying a new glucometer. It hasn't happened yet because, oddly, I've been to two local
drug stores and they were both sold out of either the meters or the test strips. I will try a third store today to see if I can find one!

[Poison Ivy]

I wonder if you can literally start to wear your pancreas out over the years from BG fluctuations. Why aren't most overweight ppl who eat SAD diabetic? This woman is thin. Is there a genetic component to some of these things? I have seen ppl do this diet perfectly and still do not get the results they want. Go figure!

[starchette]

I wonder if you can literally start to wear your pancreas out over the years from BG fluctuations. Why aren't most overweight ppl who eat SAD diabetic? This woman is thin. Is there a genetic component to some of these things? I have seen ppl do this diet perfectly and still do not get the results they want. Go figure!

Hi Poison Ivy. Yes, this is my worry, to be honest. Then again, I've read and heard about other people who seem way further into the disease process than I, and they are still able to get their numbers down.

By the way, in case anyone is wondering, I have had my c-reactive protein tested regularly, most recently in May, and it's always in the low normal range.

I did get a new glucometer. I am using the Contour Next which according to a study linked by Jeff Novick, is the most accurate. And FBG numbers are slightly lower (180s-230s) but basically in the same range.

I've been 100% complaint with MWL since Monday.

I'm giving myself until January (unless my numbers get worse) before I go to my doctor for meds. So far no symptoms or ill effects. I actually have less fatigue and am sleeping better than I have in a long time.

*Edited to correct Jeff Novick's name.