Breast cancer cured after 5 years

[gracezw]

Hi everyone,
I just talked with a neighbor who told me that she had breast cancer 7 years ago. Her doctor told her that breast cancer would be cured after 5 years, so she is now cured.
I am curious. Can someone explain to me what kind of breast cancer is curable and won’t come back, and what other kind of it will come back? I remember I read a recent post on a lady whose breast cancer had come back for 6 times.

[f00die]

https://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2015nl ... cancer.pdf
https://www.google.com/search?source=hp ... ougall.com

[gracezw]

Thanks! I have read more and found out that Dr. McDougall’s view seems to be that most breast cancer will come back. Now I don’t understand why my neighbor was told by her doctor that her breast cancer was cured after 5 years and would not come back. She had breast cancer 7 years ago.
And also it is interesting for me to know that a woman on a lifelong SAD diet may have breast cancer too, after menopause!

https://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2015nl/oct/breastcancer.pdf
https://www.google.com/search?source=hp ... ougall.com

[GeoffreyLevens]

Standare medical terminology uses 5 year survival as "cure", sometimes 10 year survival. Doctor was using that and not really thinking/communicating clearly. Sometimes it does not come back, sometimes it does. I don't think anyone knows why other than that the reasons are a complex of genetics, epigenetics, diet/environment, mental/emotional inner climate, etc. In short, the terrain is the key determining factor. So all anyone can do is optimize their terrain by eating as perfectly as they can without going off the rails, and avoiding as much as possible, outer enviro toxins, and getting current on emotional work and stress management.

[patty]

I too, have heard women mention breast cancer the 5 year rule. That is great you are having this conversation about the female body with your neighbor. Cancer is such a fear motivation word. I forget what video of Dr McDougall's it was where he said he said you can out live the cancer. I think it was in reference of prostate cancer. This is a excellent video how the word cancer is used in hysterectomies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbXMEjasI5E Hear is a excellent video about the female anatomy: https://www.hersfoundation.org/female-anatomy/ Keep questioning!!!

Aloha, patty

[gracezw]

Thank you Geoff!
If her breast cancer comes back after 5 years, would her doctor consider it as a new form of breast cancer after the old form of it was cured?

Standare medical terminology uses 5 year survival as "cure", sometimes 10 year survival. Doctor was using that and not really thinking/communicating clearly. Sometimes it does not come back, sometimes it does. I don't think anyone knows why other than that the reasons are a complex of genetics, epigenetics, diet/environment, mental/emotional inner climate, etc. In short, the terrain is the key determining factor. So all anyone can do is optimize their terrain by eating as perfectly as they can without going off the rails, and avoiding as much as possible, outer enviro toxins, and getting current on emotional work and stress management.

[gracezw]

Thank you, Patty, for your encouragement! I am curious how people I know handle things that I don't need to worry about.

I too, have heard women mention breast cancer the 5 year rule. That is great you are having this conversation about the female body with your neighbor. Cancer is such a fear motivation word. I forget what video of Dr McDougall's it was where he said he said you can out live the cancer. I think it was in reference of prostate cancer. This is a excellent video how the word cancer is used in hysterectomies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbXMEjasI5E Hear is a excellent video about the female anatomy: https://www.hersfoundation.org/female-anatomy/ Keep questioning!!!

Aloha, patty

[f00die]

cancer is an evolutionary process (one of many)
tumors are a heterogeneous mix of mutated cells
some of these cells are viable in other areas of the body
i.e. they have metastatic potential
some are not
when a tumor is found, it is not known
if that particular one is the original tumor
or just the first one found
thus when they treat it, they have to
observe to see if "the cancer comes back" (mets)
i.e. they find other tumors or a recurrence
id guess by saying ur neighbor is cured
they mean they havent found other tumors
and that enough time has passed
without discovery of new tumors

[gracezw]

Foodie, thank you. If I understand it correctly, you mean that 5 years is enough time that they haven't found other tumors, but new tumors may show up later.

cancer is an evolutionary process (one of many)
tumors are a heterogeneous mix of mutated cells
some of these cells are viable in other areas of the body
i.e. they have metastatic potential
some are not
when a tumor is found, it is not known
if that particular one is the original tumor
or just the first one found
thus when they treat it, they have to
observe to see if "the cancer comes back" (mets)
i.e. they find other tumors or a recurrence
id guess by saying ur neighbor is cured
they mean they havent found other tumors
and that enough time has passed
without discovery of new tumors

[patty]

Thank you, Patty, for your encouragement! I am curious how people I know handle things that I don't need to worry about.

I too, have heard women mention breast cancer the 5 year rule. That is great you are having this conversation about the female body with your neighbor. Cancer is such a fear motivation word. I forget what video of Dr McDougall's it was where he said he said you can out live the cancer. I think it was in reference of prostate cancer. This is a excellent video how the word cancer is used in hysterectomies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbXMEjasI5E Hear is a excellent video about the female anatomy: https://www.hersfoundation.org/female-anatomy/ Keep questioning!!!

Aloha, patty

I remember Dr. Esselstyn talking about breast cancer, that women are not afraid of suffering or death, they are afraid of being alone. That is a lynch pin with doctors, and the importance of women knowing their bodies. There is a difference between being alone and lonely. The fact that Dr. McDougall had to assist Hawaii's legislator to create a law telling women before they sign a consent form they have to be told they can have a lumpectomy vs. a mastectomy. After giving a lunchtime lecture, he asked a fellow doctor if he could see his afternoon schedule. And in seeing the mastectomies he questioned and the response was to let the next generation to do it. Nora Coffey would like a law that women would have to see the anatomy video of her uterus prior to having a partial or full hysterectomy.

Aloha, patty

[Vegankit]

Thank you Geoff!
If her breast cancer comes back after 5 years, would her doctor consider it as a new form of breast cancer after the old form of it was cured?

I've done research in this area as well as clinical testing on patients. Looking at the genetic changes, including mutations in the tumor cells, we can determine if the "new" breast cancer tumor is the original tumor growing back or if it's a new tumor. Sometimes it's more complicated than that - we've had patients who returned with a second tumor in the breast only to discover that it was metastatic tumors from other cancer sites in the body. Prior to molecular testing the assumption would be that the breast cancer had returned. This has important implications for treatment decisions.

[gracezw]

Patty, thank you for your response. Women with breast cancer are not alone --- there are so many of them around me. They prefer to have cancer so they are the same as everybody else.

[gracezw]

Thank you for your explanation. It is really complicated.

Thank you Geoff!
If her breast cancer comes back after 5 years, would her doctor consider it as a new form of breast cancer after the old form of it was cured?

I've done research in this area as well as clinical testing on patients. Looking at the genetic changes, including mutations in the tumor cells, we can determine if the "new" breast cancer tumor is the original tumor growing back or if it's a new tumor. Sometimes it's more complicated than that - we've had patients who returned with a second tumor in the breast only to discover that it was metastatic tumors from other cancer sites in the body. Prior to molecular testing the assumption would be that the breast cancer had returned. This has important implications for treatment decisions.

[GeoffreyLevens]

Thank you Geoff!
If her breast cancer comes back after 5 years, would her doctor consider it as a new form of breast cancer after the old form of it was cured?

That I do not know. Sometimes they check the cancer cells genetics or something to see if same cell line and new vs recurrance based on that I think. But I really don't know. Never really cared enough to find out because I think the whole approach is so wrong headed.

[gracezw]

Geoff, thanks for your response. We don't need to know that much in our small and safe plant-based community because we are well protected. But people out there in the big scary world are so vulnerable.

That I do not know. Sometimes they check the cancer cells genetics or something to see if same cell line and new vs recurrance based on that I think. But I really don't know. Never really cared enough to find out because I think the whole approach is so wrong headed.