Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

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Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

Postby MikeyG » Sun May 20, 2018 11:02 pm

Dear Jeff,

I hope that this message finds you very well.

As it appears you frequently buy tomato puree and whole tomatoes in tomato puree, as they are often the easiest to find, no-added-salt tomato options in supermarkets, what is your opinion about using tomato paste in place of the puree and reconstituting the paste into a puree-like form with extra water?

As no-added-salt tomato paste seems widely available, and the ingredients for many tomato purees are tomato paste and water, I was curious to know if you thought this might be a potential and affordable option for the tomatoes in many of your SNAP meals.

Many of the canned, no-salt-added diced tomatoes appear to be canned in tomato juice, which seems like it could be similarly problematic to the paste and puree, as the juice seems less satiating than the pureed tomatoes.

(Your previous comments on blending foods, for anyone interested:
viewtopic.php?p=367944#p367944 )

As always, your thoughts would be appreciated.

SNAP meals would certainly be more affordable if tomato paste were used in place of many of the tomato options, and the tomato paste would also be easier to store.

(My presumption is that for most people, and as a general recommendation, you would not recommend a significant use of tomato paste or puree. However, for those hoping to gain weight, it seems like the paste and puree are more calorie-dense than fresh or canned diced tomatoes, and therefore might be a useful option for taking in additional calories, especially when using your SNAP templates.

In addition, for endurance athletes, I wonder if the tomato paste might be a good alternative to the energy gels that are frequently used.)

Thank you, as always, for your consideration, your potential feedback, and for all that you do.

Please have a wonderful day.

Warmly,
Michael
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Re: Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

Postby JeffN » Mon May 21, 2018 8:37 am

Yes, tomato paste can be used but with some caveats as it is a different product.

I chose the ones I did, (diced tomatoes, tomato puree, whole tomatoes, peeled tomatoes, or even veggie broth) because they all provided liquid, flavor, and often some vegetable (especially if a chunkier version is chosen), a base for the meal and were low in calorie density. The paste, while still fairly low in calorie density, is ~4x the puree or diced. I would have to re-run the numbers to see if using paste alone would keep the recipe in my target calorie density zone.

The paste also won't provide the same amount of liquid so the recipe would have to be adjusted (ie, add X amount of water if using the paste). As you noted, many tomato sauces and purees are just tomato paste and water.

For the soups, I dilute out the tomatoes so if the paste was used for the soups, the dilution would have to be 2-3x.

Not sure about tomato paste for athletes. Athletes try to find things they can ingest that will cause little discomfort. Straight concentrated tomato paste may cause some discomfort in some while engaging in extreme sports, which, I don't recommend engaging in.

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Re: Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

Postby MikeyG » Mon May 21, 2018 7:40 pm

Thanks, Jeff.

I just ran the numbers, out of curiosity, using data from the Cronometer:

Canned Tomato, Low Sodium (72.62 calories/lb)

Tomato, Raw (81.72 calories/lb)

Tomato Puree (172.52 calories/lb)
- 1.46:1 water:puree for 72.62 calories/lb

Tomato Paste (372.28 calories/lb):
- 4.53:1 water:paste for 72.62 calories/lb

So it appears the tomato paste would need to be significantly watered down to imitate the calorie density of canned tomato (or raw tomato). However, it appears that tomato puree is about 2.4x the calorie density of canned tomatoes, so it might be prudent to dilute there, too.

It seems that you have identified some caveats in terms of the calorie density, and you have identified issues with blending foods in the past, particularly fruit, as I mentioned before.

If someone, especially someone hoping to reduce food costs, were to use tomato paste as the tomato-base of your SNAP meals, are there any health issues you would want to pay attention to in those individuals?

I would think triglycerides and HbA1C would be two biomarkers to keep an eye on, in addition to BMI and potentially dental health. Liver markers might also be worth paying attention to, it would seem, since the blended fruit might contribute to the accumulation of liver fat:
http://www.jeffnovick.com/RD/Q_%26_As/E ... d_You.html

Please let me know if that seems prudent to you, or if you think there may be other potential issues that could arise from the use of tomato paste in place of the canned tomatoes you recommend in your SNAP meals that we have not addressed yet, even in individuals who attempt to dilute the paste to be more in line with the calorie density of canned tomatoes or tomato puree.

As mentioned, no-salt-added tomato paste seems to be very easily found in most supermarkets, so it seems like it could be a useful option for your SNAP meals if the potential harms of doing so were not too severe.

Thank you, again, for all the insight. Please have a wonderful evening.

Warmly,
Michael
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Re: Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

Postby JeffN » Mon May 21, 2018 8:24 pm

Thanks for taking the time to explain your recommendations and you thinking behind them.

However, we will disagree for several reasons. :)


First, in regard to the numbers, tomato paste is, by nature, the most concentrated of the tomato products. That is what tomato paste is by definition. It is even sold in squeeze tubes like toothpaste.

For example, lets use a couple Hunts products

Hunts tomato paste, no salt added
https://smartlabel.labelinsight.com/pro ... /nutrition
30 cal per 33 gram serving = 412 calories per pound.

Hunts diced tomatoes, no salt added
https://smartlabel.labelinsight.com/pro ... /nutrition
30 cal per 121 gram serving = 112 calories per pound

Hunts tomato Sauce, no salt added
https://smartlabel.labelinsight.com/pro ... /nutrition
20 calories per 62 gram serving = 146 calories per pound

The original template was based on the POMI diced tomatoes,
https://www.vitacost.com/pomi-chopped-tomatoes
28 calories per 125 gram serving = 102 calories per pound.
The only ingredient is tomatoes.

That is a ~3-4x the calorie density. As I said, while it is not a huge difference and all the products are low in calorie density, there is a difference and for the simple template, I don't use the paste.


Second, we can find most generic canned tomato products for ~$1.00 -1.25 per 28 oz can at your local grocery store and even cheaper if you do some bargain shopping or buy larger cans. Based on that pricing, my SNAP meals came out to $3-$4 dollars per person per day. That is $90-$120 per month. Even at $5 per day, that is still only $150 per month per person. All these prices are below the actual SNAP program level of assistance. I’m not sure switching to tomato paste & having to dilute it will make a huge savings difference.


Third, the SNAP meals are not blended and while there is some liquid in some of the varieties of the diced tomatoes, the majority of the weight and bulk/volume comes from tomatoes. Even in the tomato sauce, we are only looking at a small contribution to the total calories of the recipe. I don't want to have to dilute the tomato paste in each recipe and for the others, the difference is minor enough to me for it not to matter. The reason is, the majority of the calories come from minimally processed whole grains, starchy vegetables, legumes and veggies. In regard to blending, my main concern is fruit and large quantities of it (Ie, smoothies). These same concerns have not been shown with vegetables, which I have covered in these forums in the "soup vs smoothie threads".


Fourth, considering all the above, I can't see any reason any of these would impact anyone's A1c or Trigycerides, nor have I ever seen that happen. In fact, just the opposite. Many have chosen to just live on my SNAP template, often for week or months at a time and have recovered their health and reversed their diseases.

Now, perhaps if someone was drinking juice and/or consuming smoothies for full meals, then perhaps, depending on their health, it may be a concern. However, not because of the small contribution the tomato sauce or liquid in the diced tomatoes would make to a full SNAP recipe. The tomato, while botanically a fruit, is considered a vegetable in nutrition because thee nutrition composition (including caloric content, calorie density and amount of carbs) is much closer to the vegetable group then the fruit group.


Lastly, anywhere you are going to find no salt added tomato paste, you are also going to find no salt added diced tomatoes, etc.


My SNAP meals are only a template and were tested over years (actually decades) and the formula was based on what is most readily available, easiest, simplest and meets my numbers for calorie density. Anyone is welcome to change things and make it their own as that’s part of the fun. I encourage people to be creative and use different varieties of tomatoes (liquid), beans, starch, vegetables and spice. I’m always looking for a way to maker it easier, simpler and cheaper and so I appreciate your efforts. Just not sure you have demonstrated that.

Again, thanks for your thoughts and your suggestions and if it works for you, enjoy!

However, I think I will keep the basic template, and the basic tomato product recommendations, as is. :)

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Re: Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

Postby MikeyG » Sat May 26, 2018 8:31 pm

Thanks, Jeff. I appreciate the further clarification, although I'm still not sure what the final verdict is on the tomato paste.

Your first response seemed to suggest it was a product that could be used, albeit with potential caveats in terms of calorie density.

However, your second, more detailed response, would suggest that despite calorie density and lack of convenience seeming to be the major caveats with the tomato paste, and not really any health concerns, you're not a fan, and likely wouldn't recommend the use of paste in favor of the other tomato products you listed in your SNAP template, even the tomato sauce or tomato puree.

Does that seem to correspond with your statements?

As you mentioned the ability to find affordable, no-salt added canned tomato options, do you have any more specific suggestions for how to accomplish that?

In the past you mentioned Vitacost, but I've yet to see anything as affordable as what you've mentioned in my local supermarkets or online, aside from this Walmart 6-pack of 14.5 oz no-salt added tomatoes, which goes for $0.72 per 14.5 oz can:

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value- ... s/47234744

The nutrition label for the actual can is here, for anyone interested:
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value- ... z/22002647

Thanks, Jeff. I appreciate the support in attempting to make the SNAP system easier and more affordable to accomplish.

Please have a great day.

Warmly,
Michael
---
On a side note, Dei Fratelli appears to be one of the few companies whose tomato puree is not made from tomato paste or reconstituted tomatoes:

"Yes, our puree is seedless, however, please remember to keep in mind that because our products are made from fresh tomatoes, and not tomato paste or reconstituted tomatoes and water, we cannot guarantee any of our products are seedless. While we do try to remove seeds from many of our products, it is too easy for seeds to sneak in. Products such as our Tomato and Vegetable juices or Dei Fratelli Puree are most likely not to have any seeds, but we can't guarantee them to be seedless."

https://www.amazon.com/Dei-Fratelli-Tom ... puree&th=1
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Re: Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

Postby JeffN » Sun May 27, 2018 5:25 am

Maybe I am missing your point.

My position expressed in both the posts above are the same and are no different then what I expressed in the original post years ago and the same as I teach in the cooking demo.

I thought this summed it all up...

My SNAP meals are only a template and were tested over years (actually decades) and the formula was based on what is most readily available, easiest, simplest and meets my numbers for calorie density. Anyone is welcome to change things and make it their own as that’s part of the fun. I encourage people to be creative and use different varieties of tomatoes (liquid), beans, starch, vegetables and spice.


Again, thanks for your thoughts and your suggestions and if it works for you, enjoy!


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Re: Tomato Paste for SNAP Meals

Postby MikeyG » Sun May 27, 2018 3:46 pm

Thanks, Jeff. I just wanted to make sure I understood your opinion, and that sums it up well. I appreciate the compassion.

Please have a great day, and I hope that the weather in Florida holds up well for you. The state is very lucky to have you, as are the rest of us.

Thanks, as always, for all that you do.

Warmly,
Michael
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