Chef AJ/ calorie density question

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Chef AJ/ calorie density question

Postby Adrienne » Wed Jul 27, 2016 4:46 pm

Hi Jeff,

I am hoping you can clear something up for me:

In an October 2015 webinar Chef AJ said that Barbara Rolls discovered that if you keep calorie density at 550 calories per pound then it’s very difficult to be overweight.

She interviewed Barbara Rolls for a teleclass in February 2016 and said that she heard the "many people that teach this" (perhaps meaning you) say that if you keep the average calorie density at 600 cal per pound, not only will you not be overweight but you can get down to a lean weight. She asked Barbara Rolls if she agreed with that statement and Rolls replied that she agreed to a certain extent but that they needed more studies.

Then in a webinar a month later AJ claimed that, according to the scientific research done Barbara Rolls ,if you keep calorie density at 567 cal per pound then you "absolutely can't gain weight."

I am very familiar with Dr McD’s writings and I noticed that AJ attempted to recite his books/articles in the webinars yet she misquoted him. I am not familiar with Barbara Rolls’ books or research but it appears that AJ misquoted her as well.

Could you please clarify what the correct numbers are and where they originated from?

Thanks
Adrienne
 
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Re: Chef AJ/ calorie density question

Postby JeffN » Sun Jul 31, 2016 8:11 am

Adrienne wrote:Hi Jeff,

I am hoping you can clear something up for me:

In an October 2015 webinar Chef AJ said that Barbara Rolls discovered that if you keep calorie density at 550 calories per pound then it’s very difficult to be overweight.

She interviewed Barbara Rolls for a teleclass in February 2016 and said that she heard the "many people that teach this" (perhaps meaning you) say that if you keep the average calorie density at 600 cal per pound, not only will you not be overweight but you can get down to a lean weight. She asked Barbara Rolls if she agreed with that statement and Rolls replied that she agreed to a certain extent but that they needed more studies.

Then in a webinar a month later AJ claimed that, according to the scientific research done Barbara Rolls ,if you keep calorie density at 567 cal per pound then you "absolutely can't gain weight."

I am very familiar with Dr McD’s writings and I noticed that AJ attempted to recite his books/articles in the webinars yet she misquoted him. I am not familiar with Barbara Rolls’ books or research but it appears that AJ misquoted her as well.

Could you please clarify what the correct numbers are and where they originated from?

Thanks


Sure.

Without going into all the details,

...the 550 comes from a study, of which, Dr Rolls was one of the co-authors but not the lead author (she was listed last of about 7).

... the 567 comes from the AICR/WCRF 2007 Second Expert Report: Food, Nutrition, Physical activity and the Prevention of Cancer: a Global Perspective.

However, and for the record, you won't find the exact numbers (550 or 567), in either of the papers as they don't exist in them nor will you find them used at their websites or by the authors or organizations. They are numbers I came up with to use in my Calorie Density presentation right after each paper came out using a little conversion, rounding, adaption and interpretation. There were few others teaching Calorie Density back then and of those I know, they were not using these numbers.

... the 600 comes from me and from my personal experience over the 10 years when I was Director of Nutrition at Pritikin and it is an average of a range.

I do use the 3 numbers in my presentation individually and then collectively to make a point and am probably the first one to do this. So while each of the numbers have some value, and it is helpful to understand where they come from and what they mean, my main point in discussing them is what the 3 combined tell us, not just any single one of them.

However, none of these numbers represent or are ever used or presented by me (or anyone else I know of) as...

"if you keep calorie density at "X" calories per pound then it’s very difficult to be overweight."

"if you keep calorie density at "X" cal per pound then you "absolutely can't gain weight."

"if you keep the average calorie density at "X" cal per pound, not only will you not be overweight but you can get down to a lean weight."

In fact, in one of the studies, 6% of those averaging the number were obese and one of the other numbers is the midpoint of a range where people either lost, maintained or gained weight.

I used these numbers to help form a few of my principles and guidelines of calorie density (which do not use any specific numbers).

I am a bit surprised though in regard to her confusion because, as far as I know, she has seen my Calorie Density presentation (where the numbers are all discussed) several times including twice at the VegSource Conferences, and when we worked together at the first Engine2/WFM event and the first Meals for Health program, and has emailed me specifically about these numbers after watching my DVD and we have discussed calorie density in this forum a few times.

As I've always said, Calorie Density is a set of guidelines and principles (not specific numbers or guarantees) that you apply and adjust as needed to your own situation (health status, weight, activity level, metabolism, food sensitivities, allergies and preferences etc). They are not "rules" nor are they carved in stone. They are only guidelines. They are not just for weight loss but lifelong weight management. There is no 550, 567 or 600 (or any specific number) in my final recommendations or my guidelines & principles of calorie density. The beauty of understanding the principle of calorie density is that you don't have to know any numbers to be successful. If anyone is caught up in the numbers, they are missing the point of calorie density. And, just like with the cholesterol of 150 and a BMI or 18.5-22, there is no one number that guarantees anything for anyone.

I hope that helps

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Re: Chef AJ/ calorie density question

Postby Adrienne » Thu Aug 04, 2016 2:25 pm

Thanks for the comprehensive reply.

That is strange that you say you have helped her so much because in the webinars/teleclass she named the people who taught her about calorie density (Drs McD, Lisle, Goldhammer) but she never mentioned you. I have noticed this in her other webinars/teleclasses as well.

In light of all of this IMO it seems rather disingenuous that she did not give you any credit.

Just to add, in one of the webinars she held up her “vision board,” which is filled with inspirational words, phrases and pictures. One side seemed to be completely health-related, while on the other side you see “FORTUNE” and “$100 000” twice. At the same time I was recently made aware that Potato Strong is essentially charging almost $2000 for a few phone calls and a bunch of stuff that you and Dr McD give away for free.

It appears that you and Dr McD have an entirely different mentality and I can’t tell you how much I appreciate that. Surely many others feel the same way.
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Re: Chef AJ/ calorie density question

Postby JeffN » Sat Aug 06, 2016 10:17 am

Adrienne wrote: It appears that you and Dr McD have an entirely different mentality and I can’t tell you how much I appreciate that. Surely many others feel the same way.


Thanks!

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Re: Chef AJ/ calorie density question

Postby JeffN » Tue Sep 13, 2016 1:49 pm

The full DVD presentation, Calorie Density: How To Eat More, Weigh Less & Live Longer, is available here for free.

Calorie Density: How To Eat More, Weigh Less & Live Longer!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CdwWliv7Hg

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Re: Chef AJ/ calorie density question

Postby JeffN » Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:37 am

The history, science, meaning and application of the numbers mentioned above and these cut-offs comes up all the time. Many interpret these to have more meaning then they actually do and there is a lot of misinformation out there. I was just involved in a conversation over them on FB and am copying my comments here..

“I just spoke to the person who has done more research in CD then anyone else. Their cut-offs are slightly different then mine but they agree, there is no hard science behind the cut-offs and we can’t say “X” cut-off or “number” will “guarantee” any result. And now today, with all the weight management companies (and weight management guru’s) out there incorporating CD into their work, and coming up with their own cut-offs, categories and lists of “free” foods, it is only more confusing. As I have always said, these are only guidelines based on my personal and professional experience and my understanding of the literature and are a starting point and must be applied to the individual and adjusted as needed.”

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