The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

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The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby f1jim » Sun Oct 09, 2011 11:35 am

There are at least two people that feel that the various "challenges" that pop up on the forum are unnecessary and demeaning to those not participating. These challenges encourage a particular aspect of the diet such as no processed foods or complete adherence to the plan for a specified number of days. I have been asked to stop these challenges and allow the normal journaling without challenges.
It's my own belief that these challenges can be helpful to many in making the changes to diet for an extended period and get them through any transition problems they may encounter. I do not see these challenges as interfering with anyones decision to follow their own path or speed to following the program. I know there are PM's floating about supporting the removal of these challenges. Unless I can see a good reason these challenges are somehow negatively impacting others I am reluctant to interfere. They not only seem rather harmless to those not participating but actually encourage some to more seriously pursue this program. I see that as positive, not negative. No one is forced to participate and they seem to have a very positive impact on peoples efforts.
That's my take and if there is something I am missing about this issue please message me and let me know what I am not grasping.
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby SunshineDay » Sun Oct 09, 2011 11:45 am

Gosh, really??? But it was exactly Chile's September Challenge that really and truly got me back on board the McDougall wagon. I'd been wishy-washilly trying all summer to get my McDougall act together -- it was the very idea of the September Compliance Challenge that finally put me in the true proper mindset. I figured, 'Hey, I can do this for a month, and do it RIGHT...' -- well, that month has come and gone and I'm still at it. And very very pleased and happy with my progress I might add. And have the Challenge to directly thank for it besides -- without it I might very well not be where I am right now (actually, i KNOW full well I wouldn't be where I am now)....
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby blondie » Sun Oct 09, 2011 11:58 am

I agree with you, Jim. Nobody is forcing anyone to do anything. If a few of us want to journal our individual progress during any given month, and call it a challenge, how is that bothering anyone? This forum is here so that members can provide support to one another in following the McDougall plan -- that is exactly what these challenges do for me, whether it be my exercise thread, or my MWL weigh-in participation, or my personal journal thread. Is there something wrong with encouraging one another to eat more veggies, be more consistent with exercise, or eat less processed food? I must be missing something, because I don't understand where the offense lies in that?
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby Adrienne » Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:23 pm

Sounds like some people are feeling unnecessarily threatened and insecure. Perhaps these people know deep down inside that they themselves should be participating in these challenges rather than criticizing them.
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby to_our_health » Sun Oct 09, 2011 2:31 pm

In general I'm with you at the moment Jim.

I think some are concerned that newbies may get the wrong impression and think that the focus of any particular challenge is the only "right" or "true" way, with the danger that that thinking might lead them astray.

We can only hope that most people will spend time really learning the program through the whole variety of resources here and elsewhere as well as spend the time doing it, really listening to their own body's responses and tweaking it appropriately for them.

I have seen some challenges that seem overly strict and nit-picky to me, or at least at times the feedback during them does, so I ignore them and do my own thing. But I think that some newer people, perhaps with insecurities, take things somewhat personally and get hooked in so to speak with the "authority" they grant to the "challenger" and an unhealthy dynamic can result.

I agree that people here are generally trying to be helpful, in their own ways. But everyone's way is different, and some rub some people the wrong "way"! :? In that case, my advice would always be for the person involved to take themselves back to the source material as it is all there...in the free program on this site, in the newsletters and recipes, in the books and lectures.

Maybe we could use a sticky about this and challenges?
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby dlb » Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:24 pm

I also see challenges as a positive thing. It was a stepping "challenge" that got me to start being consistent with my exercising. I still remember the people who joined in and encouraged me and I am still very grateful to them. It was an important part of my journey.
To read how the McDougall Program helped me reach my goals, go here:

http://www.drmcdougall.com/stars/donna_byrnes.html
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby StarchBeet » Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:24 pm

I think people need to understand themselves better. I haven't done well with challenges but that's my own personal thing. I didn't feel like anyone judged me, though I do want people to call things to my attention if I miss something. If you don't want to participate then feel free not to. Why is that harmful?

I have learned more about myself on this path and I still don't know why the weekly weigh-in seemed to throw me off. I have to figure out how to get back on the MWL challenge for myself. I've come a long way and as my life would have it I have a long way to go.

I'm going to do the Indian Challenge in November since I want to learn more about the many ingredients (vegetables and spices)that go into making Indian dishes.

I wish everyone the best on their path of daily challenges of what life tosses at you.
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby Gramma Jackie » Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:33 pm

I certainly see nothing wrong with challenges even though I rarely participate in them myself. I have seen some message boards however that had a particular area of the board just for the challenges. In fact some diet boards I have been on had several challenges going on at once and had various interests. Such as a 100 lbs. to lose challenge, a 50 lbs. to lose challenge, or whatever they wanted to title their particular challenge. It worked out pretty good. Those who like challenges posted their challenge results in that section.

** On a side note, I think a lot of people get confused by the two McDougall programs. Dr. McDougall has said that although just about everyone can lose weight on the Maximum Weight Loss Program, some people also are able to lose weight on the regular program. I would like to see more clarity on the board about the differences. Some people, like myself have gone back and forth between MWL and the regular program and been criticized for that. I don't know why. They are both healthy. Also, everyone on the board is not here because they need to lose weight. So since we are not all in the same boat so to speak, we need to be careful how we converse with one another. Just a thought. :)
Last edited by Gramma Jackie on Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:44 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby RAS » Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:41 pm

I just posted a reply but it didn't go thru,so if this is a repeat sorry.

I find nothing wrong with the challenges.The latest one with SactoBob has really helped keep me on track.He zeroed in on my use of artificial sweetners & salt.I am here to learn all I can and the challenges do help. RAS
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby Norm » Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:47 pm

I've not participated in any of the challenges I've seen on the forum here, but I've learned a thing or two from them.
Challenging ourselves is how we improve ourselves. Some people prefer to challenge themselves quietly, others like to make a lot of noise about it, or they need/want feedback from others to help encourage them.
I could see how some might be intimidated by them... I could see some might overly in-your-face with them... but this speaks more about individual personalities than the actual challenges...
I don't see a problem keeping things the way they are. I wouldn't see a problem adding a special "Challenges" area either.

-Norm
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby Adrienne » Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:58 pm

That's true that some people "prefer to challenge themselves quietly" rather than make a lot of noise. I was one of those people years ago when I embarked on a food challenge of my own. Rather then seek out encouragement here I found it from my family members and friends. But there is nothing wrong with those wanting to use the forum for support. Hopefully lessons can be learned that people can take with them once the challenge is up.
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby AlwaysAgnes » Sun Oct 09, 2011 5:14 pm

I don't see anything wrong with the challenges. People don't have to participate or even read those threads. If creating a "challenge" section would help some feel less threatened, that might be a good idea, if there's room for a folder devoted to challenges. Of course that might also put more work on monitors. I've discovered that regardless what you do or don't do, someone won't like it. That's how life is. As for confusing newbies, it's generally recommended on all boards and forums across the internet to become acquainted with the place before jumping in. I lurked 3 years here before ever posting a thing, but that doesn't mean I won't find something here to be confused about tomorrow or next month or next year. The day I discover I have all the answers to every single question in the world is the day I might as well die. Right? I wonder what the world would be like if everyone shared a single personality....mine, of course. :wink:
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby Katydid » Sun Oct 09, 2011 7:31 pm

I've participated in a few challenges, and ignored a few, too. But then I've never been one to judge myself by another's standards. There's no rule you have to read every post. I don't go on the religious or global warming threads because I know my opinions would not be welcome there. I have no children, so I don't post in the family threads. But I don't tell others what they should or shouldn't post. The only thing I object to is people who think there is only 'their' way to 'McDougall'. Whether one chooses to follow the 12-Day program, MWL or a JeffN inspired unprocessed challenge it's all good.
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby Pacificfords » Sun Oct 09, 2011 9:54 pm

to_our_health wrote:I think some are concerned that newbies may get the wrong impression and think that the focus of any particular challenge is the only "right" or "true" way, with the danger that that thinking might lead them astray.

Maybe we could use a sticky about this and challenges?


This was my own personal experience with the challenges when I was new to the site. It was very confusing for me at that time and caused me significant failure. It led me to believe that the regular program was not good enough and that I wouldn't lose weight or improve my health if I wasn't much more strict by following the "enhanced version." So I agree in that respect.

However, understanding it so much better now and achieving my own success, the challenges seem like a very positive and creative way to motivate and encourage each other. Maybe a sticky explaining would help new people coming in to understand the purpose of the challenges and assure the validity of the regular program.
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Re: The Various "Challenges" on the forum.

Postby f1jim » Sun Oct 09, 2011 10:11 pm

It seems to me the challenges need to start with a message outlining the intent of the challenge and any differences or highlights it will focus on so that anyone reading it understands those differences. I might be wrong but a separate challenge forum defeats the idea behind a challenge because it does involve journalling. Also, it usually has people actually doing the program very close to perfection which might be a good thing for everyone to see.
But the key is the explanation at the front of the challenge. It needs to be clear, with everything spelled out carefully. If that is done there shouldn't be much griping. We can all be careful about what is said when someone either accidentally or purposefully messes up in one of the challenges. As long as everyone stays respectful and calm there should be little chance of hurt feelings.
But I also think it would be helpful if those that are against the challenges on the boards spoke up about their reasons for wanting them banned. Again, if there are good reasons I can be convinced. I haven't heard them yet.
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