McDougall Desserts

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McDougall Desserts

Postby Mbeck » Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:58 pm

If we are supposed to avoid sugar and salt, why are there desserts offered in the McDougall cookbook? I like dessert a couple times a week, however, I feel stressed that maybe I should be avoiding them completely. Can you tell me the maximum amount of sugar and salt I should have per day? Knowing what my limits are will relieve my stress.
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Re: McDougall Desserts

Postby VeggieSue » Sun Dec 24, 2017 5:53 am

First off, welcome, but this forum - The Sandbox - is where people go to test out their signatures, test how to do things like attach graphics, etc. You would be better off putting general messages like this one in The Lounge or Maximum Weight Loss forums.

Now, as for your question, not every person on the McDougall program needs to lose weight, or even has any health problem, and can have items with salt and sugar - as Dr McDougall allows them. Remember, as-written, the program is still much lower in simple carbohydrates (sugar) and salt than the SAD (Standard American Diet). Dr. McD does not allow white sugar and junk foods made from them, like cakes and soda. When one of the recipes from a McDougall book calls for a sweetener it's usually something like maple syrup, molasses, and in the past, agave. And when a recipe needs a flour product, it's always a whole grain one, whether it's whole wheat or something like brown rice flour. He does not condone white flour, no matter what people on various McDougall-centric Facebook communities say. Yes, in The Color Picture Book and a webinar or newsletter article he does mention white bread or white flour and white rice as allowed if you really can't tolerate the whole grain versions, that it's not a "game changer", but always remember the whole grain product is the one the program specified in program literature. He assumes that as you become accustomed to eating this way you'll switch to the whole grain versions of those items.

Salt is another item that has a lot of confusion around it because Dr. McDougall has said time and again that "a little salt sprinkled on the surface of your food" is allowed. But in the program literature he says to always use the no-salt added versions of packaged items, like no-salt added beans, no-salt added broth, no-salt added tomato products. People are always forgetting about that caveat, too. Dr. McDougall's dietitian, Jeff Novick, says when reading a label, make sure the sodium content is equal to or lower than the calories on a regular food item (like those beans or tomatoes or vegetable broth, etc.) and for a condiment, you can go as high as 4 times the calories, because it's hard to find even a lower-sodium version of mustard or ketchup with sodium equal to or lower than the calories.

Also remember, the McDougall program is for everyone, not just people with weight to lose or have a health condition. It is, as the title of the newest book says, the healthiest diet on the planet. As soon as a child is weaned he should be eating this way, and at every stage of life it's the perfect diet.

If you like dessert, have it after you finish your meal, and enjoy it! Remember, we're to eat when hungry, stop when full. If you ate your meal and a few minutes later are still a bit hungry, go ahead and have a bit of cobbler or any other of the McDougall dessert recipes! If it's someone's birthday, go ahead and have that piece of (McDougall-safe) birthday cake! It's going to be made with all McDougall approved ingredients and nothing harmful to your health. But if you're not hungry, don't eat it out of habit, just save it for another occasion when you *are* hungry. It's that simple.
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Re: McDougall Desserts

Postby Willijan » Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:43 pm

Mbeck wrote:If we are supposed to avoid sugar and salt, why are there desserts offered in the McDougall cookbook? I like dessert a couple times a week, however, I feel stressed that maybe I should be avoiding them completely. Can you tell me the maximum amount of sugar and salt I should have per day? Knowing what my limits are will relieve my stress.


I have been eating this way for almost 6 years, and I have wondered the same thing--why are those dessert recipes in the cookbook? It seems obvious to me that eating white flour, high amounts of sugar, and baking soda/baking powder/salt is not the best thing for one's health. However, having those recipes for the first few years is what kept me on this diet. The Starch Solution recipes include desserts with white sugar and white flour (I have the book in my hands and I just counted 5 or 6 of those), and also non-dessert recipes including more than a minimal amount of high-fat plant foods. Dr. McDougall's other books, based on my memory, do not include that type of recipe.

I suggest you need to discriminate between McDougall books, especially The Starch Solution, and what you read on this forum.

I am not aware of anything Dr. McD. has said about why The Starch Solution is so different, so I have to guess. I think he wanted to make it easier for people to stay on the diet. While sugar and white flour are not the best foods, they are better than animal foods and oil.

Given that, I think the thing to do is 1)be aware of the philosophical base of the program--whole, natural foods, which sugar and white flour are not; 2) be aware of how severe your own (known and yet to be identified) health issues are, including obesity; 3)continue to learn about the "best" version of this diet, by reading Dr. McDougalls newsletters, reading on this forum, and reading other authors such as Caldwell Esselstyn. You'll have to use these to find out what appropriate limits are for you.

For several years, I ate desserts several times a day, every day. I used only whole wheat flour. I reduced the sugar called for in the McD. recipes. Was this much dessert appropriate? No, but it allowed me to stay on the diet until I learned to like better foods. The way I stopped eating desserts so often was to eat things like oatmeal with dates instead.
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Re: McDougall Desserts

Postby JeffN » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:48 am

Mbeck wrote:If we are supposed to avoid sugar and salt, why are there desserts offered in the McDougall cookbook? I like dessert a couple times a week, however, I feel stressed that maybe I should be avoiding them completely.


Many of the recipes you are seeing that you are asking about are for occasional treats and not for daily or frequent consumption. During the 10-Day residential programs, these desserts are served ~2x with fresh fruit being served as dessert for most all other meals. While you may find some of the recipes with refined flours, whole grains are always the preferred choice.

This McDougall newsletter from December 2009 may help you better understand your questions.

Pick a Category to Work on This Year - A New Years Resolution Based on Three Decades of Success

The Relative Hazards of Foods


However, you may be unwilling or unable to make a complete turn-around to the diet I have recommended based on starches, vegetables, and fruits, all of the time. In that case, you should consider a more gradual course by eliminating foods based on the categories I outlined in our first national best-selling book The McDougall Plan (1983) by John and Mary McDougall. I have made a few modifications in order to update the lists in the categories.

Progression from Categories I through IV below lead from harmful to health-supporting foods. For those who usually follow the diet closely, these categories will identify foods least damaging to you when you do indulge on those special occasions. Anyone who is not yet ready for a complete change to a health-supporting diet as set forth in Category IV may want to improve his or her diet by beginning with the elimination of foods in Category I and progressing at his or her own chosen pace.


https://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2009nl/dec/nyr.htm

Mbeck wrote:Can you tell me the maximum amount of sugar and salt I should have per day? Knowing what my limits are will relieve my stress.


The McDougall diet is not 100% free of added salt and sugar. The recommendation is to use products that have no added salt/sugar, to cook without adding it (whenever possible) and to add a little at the table for flavor if desired. It is true that the original book had very few recipes with these products, but they have been in the recipe books since ~1990 (& maybe even earlier)

To further help people, I came up with very specific amounts that have been shown to not be harmful and allow for those who want, the ability to add some and have a specific guideline to go by. These guidelines are taught at the current residential program.

For added sugars, it is to keep the intake of all added sugars to less than 5% of calories.

For added salt, it is to keep the intake of total sodium (naturally occurring in the recommended foods and added sodium) to no more then 1200-1500 mg/day and for those who are more sensitive, between 500-1000 mg/day.

I would define these as "allowances" and not recommendations.

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