Japanese stomach cancer

For those questions and discussions on the McDougall program that don’t seem to fit in any other forum.

Moderators: JeffN, f1jim, John McDougall, carolve, Heather McDougall

Japanese stomach cancer

Postby Skip » Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:22 am

I had a brief conversation with a gastroenterologist today at the health club where I work out. He was saying that cancer is gentic and I was saying the genes load the gun and diet pulls the trigger. I used the example of breast cancer rates in the Japanese population versus the breast cancer rates of migrant Japanese that move to the U.S.

He replied that the stomach cancer rates were higher in Japan in the past and present. I looked that up and it appears to be correct.
http://www.wcrf.org/int/cancer-facts-fi ... statistics

In a past newsletter, Dr. McDougall states:

A low-fat vegetarian diet and a healthy lifestyle should be fundamental parts of every cancer patient's treatment program. This is especially true when the cancers, like breast, prostate, colon, and kidney cancer, are known to be caused, at least in part, by the rich Western diet. But, even cancers caused by other habits, such as smoking, are influenced by diet. For example, 60% of Japanese men smoke cigarettes, yet they have one-fourth the chance of dying of lung cancer as American men. Their healthier diet of mostly rice and vegetables helps them to defend against and to repair the damage from cancer-causing chemicals in tobacco smoke. In addition, lung cancer patients who stop smoking are known to live twice as long as those who continue to smoke.

So my question is the relationship between diet and stomach cancer. Why do the Japanese have a higher stomach cancer rates historically and now when their diet has been on the plant based side?
Last edited by Skip on Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
"The fundamental principle of ethics is reverence for life" Albert Schweitzer
User avatar
Skip
 
Posts: 2230
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:19 am

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby colonyofcells » Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:36 am

Stomach cancer could be from vegetables preserved with salt or fermented vegetables. Dr Greger says to avoid kimchi.
colonyofcells
 
Posts: 6377
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:14 pm
Location: san mateo ca

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby f1jim » Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:46 am

Some have postulated the cancers mentioned are from higher sodium levels in their food. Lot's of variables.
f1jim
While adopting this diet and lifestyle program I have reversed my heart disease, high cholesterol, hypertension, and lost 54 lbs. You can follow my story at https://www.drmcdougall.com/james-brown/
User avatar
f1jim
 
Posts: 11349
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:45 pm
Location: Pacifica, CA

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby petero » Thu Nov 26, 2015 12:26 pm

I've tried to do a little bit of research on this because I consume a lot of vinegar, but (almost) no added salt. There is a correlation between salt and pickled food consumption and stomach cancer, but there are studies on mice with transplanted human gastric cancer cell lines that show that acetic acid itself is selectively toxic to the gastric cancer cells, so a decent guess would be that it's the salt in pickled products. Not sure if the Japanese eat as much pickled food as, for example, Koreans, so that difference might bolster the salt theory too.
It's easy to be a naive idealist. It's easy to be a cynical realist. It's quite another thing to have no illusions and still hold the inner flame. -- Marie-Louise von Franz
User avatar
petero
 
Posts: 839
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 2:45 am
Location: Gatlinburg, TN

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby Gwen » Thu Nov 26, 2015 5:33 pm

I've heard that it's from drinking so much black tea.
Gwen
User avatar
Gwen
 
Posts: 532
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:55 pm
Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby Spiral » Thu Nov 26, 2015 8:35 pm

For most of us, the real question would be: At age 40, which population has the best live expectancy? One traffic accidents and other non-nutrition related mortality is removed from the picture, which population seems healthier? And can their superior health be entirely attributed to genetics?

But to broaden the scope of the discussion a little bit, what about the Seventh Day Adventists?

Do those Seventh Day Adventists who consume less meat, dairy and eggs (not necessarily zero meat, dairy and eggs, just less) have higher rates of stomach cancer than those who consume more?
User avatar
Spiral
 
Posts: 3005
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 8:18 pm
Location: Indianapolis, Indiana

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby arugula » Thu Nov 26, 2015 8:48 pm

i suspect that the japanese get more stomach cancers because they have a high incidence of H. pylori infections. it's protective for many health issues but a problem for others. maybe their dietary choices (pickled salted foods) are making the H. pylori more pathogenic.
arugula
 
Posts: 595
Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2009 8:36 am

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby MikeInFL » Thu Nov 26, 2015 9:23 pm

don't they use a lot of salty soy sauce?
MikeInFL
 
Posts: 274
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:19 pm

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby colonyofcells » Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:17 pm

Lots of people in asia use soy sauce. I've seen chinese pour soy sauce over white rice. Many countries in southeast asia also use fermented fish sauce and or fermented shrimp paste which are also quite salty.
colonyofcells
 
Posts: 6377
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:14 pm
Location: san mateo ca

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby patty » Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:16 am

Here you go...

The Stomach Cancer rate in Japan is Tenfold that of America

Because of America's historical and cultural emphasis on eating meat, the intestinal characteristics of Americans remain generally worse than those in Japan. However, the stomachs of many Japanese are in fact much worse than those of Americans. Having examined the stomachs of both Americans and Japanese, I have found that Japanese people are twenty times more likely to have atrophic gastritis, a condition in which the stomach mucosa becomes thin. Moreover, because atrophic gastritis increases the chances of stomach cancer, the rate of stomach cancer is ten times higher in Japan than in America.

In both America and Japan, obesity is currently a big problem. However, there are not many Japanese who are as obese as their American counterparts. The fact is, Japanese people are incapable of becoming that obese. You can even see this in sumo wrestling, where it is the sumo wrestler's duty to gain weight. There are no Japanese sumo wrestlers with a body like that of Konishiki (a Hawaiian-born American sumo wrestler who weighed over 600 pounds and rose to the second highest rank of ozeki in Japanese sumo).

The Japanese cannot become that as obese as Americans because before they reach that point, the Japanese develop stomach problems, preventing them from eating more. In other words, the reason Americans are able to become much bigger than the Japanese is that their digestive systems are stronger.

While examining stomachs using the endoscope, I found considerable differences between Japanese and Americans when it comes to the way they experience their symptoms. When I examine Japanese people, even though their condition may not be too serious, they complain about having stomach pains, feeling a great deal of discomfort, and heartburn. Interestingly, I discovered that Americans, even if their stomach or esophageal mucosa is considerably inflamed, will rarely complain as much as the Japanese about heartburn or other problems.

One reason such differences occur is the amount of vitamin A found in American food. Vitamin A protects not only the stomach mucosa, but all mucous membranes, such as those of the eye and trachea. Oil contains a lot of vitamin A. One could say that Japan's diet has become more westernized, but the volume of foods such as oil, butter and eggs that Japanese consume is much lower than the volume that Americans consume. If you think about the health of your entire body, these types of food are not good for you. But if you think only in terms of protecting mucous membranes throughout your body, they have some positive effects.

One other possibility regarding why Americans have stronger gastrointestinal systems is the number of digestive enzymes their bodies contain. Digestive enzymes break down food and help the body absorb nutrients. The number of digestive enzymes determines the digestion and absorption of food. Digestion and absorption advance step-by-step as various digestive enzymes are released at each level of digestion. These levels start with saliva and move on to the stomach, duodenum, pancreas and small intestine. Under these circumstances, if each organ secretes enough digestive enzymes, then digestion and absorption will progress smoothly. However if an insufficient amount of digestive enzymes is secreted, then it will cause indigestion and put greater burden on the rest of the organs.

The reason many Japanese people easily feel symptoms like stomach pain or discomfort, even though their stomach condition may not be bad, is that they originally have a lower number of digestive enzymes than Americans.

Furthermore, Japanese people tend to immediately take stomach medication when their stomach conditions worsen, whereas many Americans do not. What Americans do take, however, are digestive enzyme supplements. But these supplements are not sold on the market in Japan, being available only by prescription when the doctor deems it necessary. In America, digestive enzymes are extremely popular supplements. They can easily be purchased in health food stores and supermarkets.

The fact is, taking medication to suppress the secretion of stomach acid further accelerates the deterioration of the stomach lining. Highly popular antacids and stomach medications like the combination of H2 blockers and proton-pump inhibitors are advertised as being highly effective in suppressing the secretion of stomach acid. However, if stomach acid is suppressed with medication, the gastric mucosa atrophies, and the result is what I have already discussed earlier; namely, gastric mucosal atrophy progresses, and this condition may lead to the development of stomach cancer.

If you have stomach pain or discomfort, please tell your doctor exactly what your physical conditions are and then have him or her prescribe the appropriate enzyme supplements according to your symptoms. Or, shop for them in a health foods store, reading labels carefully. By taking digestive enzyme supplements, your stomach conditions will markedly improve.

Hiromi Shinya. The Enzyme Factor (p. 25). Kindle Edition.


Aloha, patty
patty
 
Posts: 6977
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:46 am

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby Ginger » Fri Nov 27, 2015 6:26 am

If smoking is a factor, it would be useful to know if there is more stomach cancer in men as they smoke more than women in Japan. Just one of those ¨I wonder if.....¨ thoughts.
Ginger
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2010 5:38 am

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby TerriNC » Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:06 am

Wow Patti! Your research resources are amazing. Can't believe you are able to find such stuff. The article is very interesting. My brother-in-law is Japanese and his parents still live there. His father has had most of his stomach removed due to stomach cancer, so I've wondered about this.
User avatar
TerriNC
 
Posts: 563
Joined: Thu May 29, 2014 9:45 am
Location: Columbus, NC

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby Skip » Fri Nov 27, 2015 12:51 pm

Thanks, patty, for that interesting reference. Taking this information into account, could we say that for stomach cancer, genetics loads the gun and pulls the trigger (that is, diet is not a factor)? Or another way of asking would be, do migrant Japanese people have the same stomach cancer rates and non-migrant Japanese? I'm not sure if your reference really answers that question.

Perhaps the gastroenterologist I had the conversation is correct when it comes to stomach cancer. That is, that the main cause of stomach cancer is genetic and diet is not as big of a factor?
"The fundamental principle of ethics is reverence for life" Albert Schweitzer
User avatar
Skip
 
Posts: 2230
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:19 am

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby colonyofcells » Fri Nov 27, 2015 3:10 pm

Cancer has many causes including pollution, radiation, etc.
colonyofcells
 
Posts: 6377
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 2:14 pm
Location: san mateo ca

Re: Japanese stomach cancer

Postby Skip » Fri Nov 27, 2015 3:54 pm

Colin Campbell has shown that cancer can be turned on and turned off with diets.
Pritikin's experiments have shown that the blood of a plant based eater is much more effective at destroying cancerous cells.

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/the-ans ... in-puzzle/

There are many causes of cancer, however, our bodies have the ability to fight cancerous cells regardless of the cause....
"The fundamental principle of ethics is reverence for life" Albert Schweitzer
User avatar
Skip
 
Posts: 2230
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:19 am

Next

Return to The Lounge

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests


cron

Welcome!

Sign up to receive our regular articles, recipes, and news about upcoming events.