Dr. McDougall's Online Discussion Board

Posted: **Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:24 am**

Dr Katz just tweeted this study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4586521/

Here is a conclusion:

Higher dairy consumption was significantly associated with 17% and 14% reduced risk of MetS in cross- sectional/case-control studies and prospective cohort studies, respectively.

And by just reading further you'll see it's like we humans need to drink milk, quote:

Globally, a large proportion of population did not meet the recommendation for dairy consumption, particularly in some developing countries in Asia and Africa

And it's funded by one of the biggest diary companies in asia: http://goo.gl/GwDfPL

It's kinda annoying that Katz is promoting this study. Why is he doing that? Is it a "well done" study without any bias in the construction of the study?

Thanks for your help!

Posted: **Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:00 am**

Sometimes I'm in the mood for going deeper into this kind of stuff. Today is not that day. (This is not meant in an antagonistic way towards the posting itself, mind you.)

Even if you find that X seems to have some marginal good effect for population Y, why would it matter to you. Vegetables and this dietary pattern has a colossal amount of good studies going for it.

Most of us don't have the overview to see this study in a very meaningful context. So it would be equally silly to "debunk" it as to think it was relevant for us.

Posted: **Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:04 am**

The Washington Post has a story today telling us the not only is full fat milk is ok, but so is anything with fat. And, of course they trot out the old healthy fat story to boot.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/10/06/for-decades-the-government-steered-millions-away-from-whole-milk-was-that-wrong/

Posted: **Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:10 am**

globally a large proportion of the population does not meet the requirement for dairy consumption. Aren't those non dairy consumers the ones who do not have metabolic syndrome like Asians before the introduction of the western diet?

I am wondering why we are the only mammalian species on earth that requires dairy after weaning and requires milk from another species in order to be healthy. Especially when there is other food available.

One of the references for the article says that avoiding dairy is associated with REDUCED risk of insulin resistance and metabolic syndrome. Lots of references but this one caught my eye.

didi

Posted: **Wed Oct 07, 2015 3:35 pm**

Globally, a large proportion of population did not meet the recommendation for dairy consumption, particularly in some developing countries in Asia and Africa

Since many (most?) Africans and Asians are lactose intolerant, I would hope that they are way behind on dairy consumption.

Posted: **Wed Oct 07, 2015 5:03 pm**

Very depressing to see that Washington Post story today. Not only was it a huge story covering a full page of text, but it started above the fold on page one. Quotes by Taubes and Teicholz, but none by any reputable researchers or doctors stating the case against. All I can think of is "face in palm".

Posted: **Thu Oct 08, 2015 4:20 am**

JacobHeitmann wrote:And it's funded by one of the biggest diary companies in asia: http://goo.gl/GwDfPL

It's kinda annoying that Katz is promoting this study. Why is he doing that? Is it a "well done" study without any bias in the construction of the study?

Thanks for your help!

Not only is it FUNDED by one of the biggest dairy companies in Asia, but it's actually WRITTEN by the biggest dairy company in Asia!!! This is worse than funding bias, it's actually an advertstudy!

IM Szeto, Y-J Li and Rv Hekezen are employees of Inner Mongolia Yili Industrial Group Co., Ltd.

I also wouldn't call this company the epitome of corporate responsibility. These quotes from Wikipedia. Why, oh why, did Dr. Katz tweet this article?

Yili was implicated in the milk scandal after tests found its infant formula contained melamine. Yili recalled tainted milk powders and apologised to the public.[6] Shares in other listed dairy companies fell strongly the next day.[7] On discovery that their liquid milk was also contaminated, Yili was stripped of its status as a 'Chinese national brand'.[8]

Hong Kong and Singapore authorities ordered a recall of Yili products after 8 out of 30 tested positive for melamine.[9] Mengniu, whose product tested negative in Hong Kong government tests, and Yili liquid milk was immediately withdrawn by supermarket chains after tests showed that contaminated samples had been found on the mainland.[10]

As of 18 September 2008, no one is believed to have been made ill because of the tainted yoghurt.[11] However, Hong Kong doctors found a stone in the left kidney of a three-year-old girl who had been drinking the contaminated Yili milk for 15 months.[12]

2012[edit]
In June 2012, Yili recalled some of its baby formula products after an "unusual" level of mercury was found by China's General Administration of Quality Supervision, Inspection and Quarantine (AQSIQ).[13]

Posted: **Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:58 am**

Thanks everyone, I know it doesn't mean anything to look any deeper into this study. I'm just so dissapointed in Katz, my respect for him just disappeared. He can't be trusted from my point of view. Thanks for looking at the study.

Posted: **Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:45 pm**

JacobHeitmann wrote:Thanks everyone, I know it doesn't mean anything to look any deeper into this study. I'm just so dissapointed in Katz, my respect for him just disappeared. He can't be trusted from my point of view. Thanks for looking at the study.

I did reply to his tweet and he replied back, saying that he was just sharing the article, not endorsing it.

Posted: **Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:02 pm**

StarchHEFP wrote:
JacobHeitmann wrote:Thanks everyone, I know it doesn't mean anything to look any deeper into this study. I'm just so dissapointed in Katz, my respect for him just disappeared. He can't be trusted from my point of view. Thanks for looking at the study.

I did reply to his tweet and he replied back, saying that he was just sharing the article, not endorsing it.

Sharing for whose expense? Typical Emperor without any clothes.

Aloha, patty

Posted: **Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:07 pm**

patty wrote:
StarchHEFP wrote:
JacobHeitmann wrote:Thanks everyone, I know it doesn't mean anything to look any deeper into this study. I'm just so dissapointed in Katz, my respect for him just disappeared. He can't be trusted from my point of view. Thanks for looking at the study.

I did reply to his tweet and he replied back, saying that he was just sharing the article, not endorsing it.

Sharing for whose expense? Typical Emperor without any clothes.

Aloha, patty

My son (6 at the time) asked about the word "miscellaneous" and asked what it meant. When we explained he said very succinctly:
"Such a long word for little meaning!" and that's how I see some writings of Dr. Katz too sometimes.

It's like he says in every blog post "eat dairy or don't eat dairy. Eat meat or don't eat meat. My family and I eat mostly plants. You can eat well or badly on a standard American diet, and Paleo and Vegan are both better than standard American diet. etc. etc. Eat food, mostly plants, not too much, follow Pollan." He will not go against Paleo because his "Glimmer initiative / true health coalition" includes the paleo guru Cordain. He definitely has plant-based leanings but is very careful in his writings not to offend anyone. He does hint at the detrimental environment effect of meat, etc. Cowspiracy anyone?

Posted: **Sun Oct 11, 2015 8:11 pm**

StarchHEFP wrote:
My son (6 at the time) asked about the word "miscellaneous" and asked what it meant. When we explained he said very succinctly:
"Such a long word for little meaning!" and that's how I see some writings of Dr. Katz too sometimes. It's like he says in every blog post "eat dairy or don't eat dairy. Eat meat or don't eat meat. My family and I eat mostly plants. You can eat well or badly on a standard American diet, and Paleo and Vegan are both better than standard American diet. etc. etc. Eat food, mostly plants, not too much, follow Pollan." He will not go against Paleo because his "Glimmer initiative / true health coalition" includes the paleo guru Cordain. He definitely has plant-based leanings but is very careful in his writings not to offend anyone. He does hint at the detrimental environment effect of meat, etc. Cowspiracy anyone?

They say our children mirror our subconscious, it sounds like you are doing a excellent job parenting.

Aloha, patty

Posted: **Sun Oct 11, 2015 11:09 pm**

StarchHEFP wrote:Such a long word for little meaning!" and that's how I see some writings of Dr. Katz too sometimes. :)

What a brilliant post(s) StarchHEFP.

I am disappointed with those plant-based doctors who have signed up on the Glimmer initiative.

This also was excellent:

patty wrote:Sharing for whose expense? Typical Emperor without any clothes.

Dr. McDougall's Online Discussion Board

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