Discussion Board

didi just wanted to add that you said on the webmd forum that besides the fish you were often eating chips and cheese when you were at your daughter's house once or twice a week. Even if you were avoiding those foods recently (as you stated) still they build up a lot of damage over time. And as the others pointed out diabetes for 20 yrs is damaging as well.

Didi:

I think you have the right question.. I don't think enough research has been done or at least I have seen any to answer your question. There are people who will eat significantly worse than me as well less active and still they have 150 total cholesterol and good ratios. The part I have never seen an answer on what causes fats and sugars to turn into Triglycerides and LDL in some people with little or no visceral fat and in some people they just metabolize it into visceral fat but their blood has near normal cholesterol.

The part that I do understand from Dr. Essystlyn and McDougall and other plant based diet researchers is that plant based diet does help reduce cholesterol and does help reduce weight. So irrespective of how your body has reacted to fats and sugars this diet does help.


Sanjay

Hi Didi,
I am very sorry for the emotional turmoil you are experiencing. No one can fully understand what you are going through right now. Although I cannot give you any words that will go very far to help with the situation, I would like to relate an anecdote that I sometimes consider when I think of how I would proceed if the day ever came that my many years of cigarette smoking and weekend drinking binges were to overtake the health benefits I enjoy from this way of life. I have a proactive dentist. The number of crowns he's installed cause the SF Occupy movement to consider my head part of the 1%. A few years before I began eating this way he sent me to an oral surgeon for a slice and dice of my gums. I was sitting in the chair as he was threading a half mile of suture material through my gums, and I thought to myself, "I guess this is what life is going to be like from now on; from one procedure to the next,..." I was nearing the age at which my father had his first diagnosed heart attack, the one that led to his death two years later. At the time my GP would constantly ask me if I had any chest pains, and he did it with such enthusiasm that I cannot help but believe that he received some kind of referral fee from the vascular surgeons. I was vegetarian and believed that I tried to reasonably follow the precepts that I believed Pritikin advocated, although, of course, not to the level that is prescribed here or in Dr Esselstyn's program. When my sister died about a month after her quadruple bypass, I knew that I had to do something. That was about 3 years ago, and I know my diet is light years ahead of what it had been for the decades before. In the late 80's I began marathoning, and I lost quite a bit of weight, eventually growing into a pattern of dropping 40 or 50 pounds when the training season began and gaining them again after the marathon season. The same GP who seemed so interested in seeing that I get a preventative bypass once remarked to me that, "Perhaps all that running may have saved your life, but no matter how far you run you can't outrun your genes." I've often considered that remark, and I believe it to be true. But we do not need to become an accomplice to that murder, and we can take every possible step to prevent it. Will we be successful? Of course not. Nobody gets out alive. But, if you take me, for example, one of my main reasons for adopting this way of life was to, perhaps, some day run another marathon. My slow decay had me at the point that I could barely run a mile without stopping to catch my breath. I am now about a year older than my father was when he died. I left the house at 5:30 this morning, and ran 7 and a half miles to the gym(OK, well, waddled 7 and a half ...). And if that's not the great shining carrot at the end of the stick that keeps us continuing on this treadmill, at least it's enough inspiration to restore some hope.

I'm sorry that there is nothing I can do or say to assure you that you will be spared those horrors that must have run through your mind when you were diagnosed with the MI, but it is the volatility of life that makes it so precious. And if that is not reason enough to try to experience every possible moment of it in the best health that we can, then I don't know what is.

Mark

Glad you survived your heart attack. I happen to be rereading the Esselstyn book, Prevent and Reverse Heart Disease and your situation reminds me of something I just read:

In the very first paragraph of Chapter 1 it describes Joe Crowe, who at 44 with no family history of heart disease, not overweight or diabetic, no high blood pressure or bad cholesterol, had a heart attack. Because of his coronary artery anatomy he couldn't have the usual treatment of stents, bypass, angioplasty, etc. so he went to Dr. Esselstyn, adopted his diet (he "redefined the word commitment"), and after 2 years had completely reversed the damage that was done in his "widowmaker" left anterior descending coronary artery. The pictures of his arteries are included in the book. It just goes to show numbers can only show so much and 100% commitment is the way to go if you want to make your arteries heart attack proof.

I think reading the book might be inspiring to you.

Also I would try to find more healthy meals that you like, so you will have substitutes when you want things that are off plan.

Hope that helps and hope you have a good recovery.

Didi,
I remember back in my Weight Watchers days a fellow stood up to give a testimonial. He had lost 150 pounds and THEN had had a major heart attack. He was very philosophical about it. His (and his doctor's) conclusion? If he hadn't lost the weight he would have died. You might consider this. What would have happened if you had had your heart attack after a high fat meal where you blood had turned to sludge? The fact that you were following this WOE - however imperfectly - may be the reason you survived.
Kate

Hi didi:

I am reposting your initial comment here, because you hit on an interesting thing that maybe folks are not aware of here. That is people who are very obese or morbidly obese don't typically have diabetes, which tends to occur in the overweight/ midlin obesity range. I think one of the Docs at the last ASW - mentioned this. If not at that event, then another recent video - by one of the docs we all follow -- covered this issue.

So, the guys you mentioned above who are eating really 100 % terrible diets, actually may NOT have the high heart risk factors you do, even though maybe only 10% of your food is in that category. Unbelievable as it sounds, it's very likely the case!

Just wanted to comment on what Caroveggie wrote regarding Dr E's book:

Dr Ess said that Joe Crowe had "relatively low cholesterol" (156). However his LDL was 98 before he began the diet which is not optimal. It subsequently went down to 38.

And while on the topic of cholesterol numbers, I think I read or heard Dr McD say that those who have genetically lower cholesterol have higher risks of colon cancer b/c they excrete more cholesterol via the colon where it promotes cancer growth, or something like that.

So perhaps genes that predispose people to lower cholesterol - and perhaps lower risks of heart disease - predispose them to other problems, such as colon cancer.

Dr. McDougall has described us as freaks of nature. Even at my maximum weight of 486 I was not diabetic and I had cholesterol numbers many of you here would happily trade for. But before you start thinking those "freaks" have it made... remember that living life that large is like living in your own self inflicted prison. They don't have any sort of life you'd want to trade for.

-Norm

didi, I can identify with what you are feeling. After my heart attack 6 years ago (100% blockage in left anterial descending artery) I went through a whole range of emotions. I went from shock that someone at my age, 42, could have a heart attack. I blamed my parents for both having heart disease and giving it to me. Then I was angry that I ate better than most people I know, yet I'm the one that got sick. Then I was depressed and frightened, not knowing what my life going forward would be like. Then I was angry with myself for letting myself get sick. It would go it cycles and I never knew what my emotional state would be like.

I continue to go through these feelings and often think that I should just not worry about it, eat and drink like everyone else and when it's my time, it's my time. But that is not really what I want. I want to spend a long life with my soul mate. I want to enjoy our retirement together and go hiking and swimming and bikeriding. I want to have a good quality of life for as long as I can.

It's very normal to think "why me". I still do that from time to time. Please keep following this way of life and give yourself the best possible chance of a great quality of life.

Didi I remember you sharing about the discomfort you felt in your chest for 3 or 4 days, or maybe a week before going to ER. And your Mom's life's process with heart disease. There is a saying if you tell me about your past I can tell you about your future. In listening to Dr. McDougall's electures... not sure which one as I downloaded them all and play them on my ipod in the car to listen going to and from work.. it is the best place to listen.. he essence he was sharing about someone who is feeling the discomfort in their chest, to tweak their WOE program and within 3 weeks the discomfort leaves.

In thinking about your story, I remembered my son, who Thank God, doesn't have medical insurance, had complained about pain/discomfort in his chest and when he got serious about his diet and the pain/discomfort did leave. He still eats meat but really exercises. He has two friends that already have had bypasses. He still hasn't made the 180 degree turn with this WOE, though he has lost weight. My mother, his grandmother died at 70 from heart disease.

Many years ago, I remember my herbologist who taught us how to read the whites of the eyes, shared someone could have a perfect diet and say someone who surfs everyday who didn't watch their diet would be healthier, because the lymphatic system doesn't have a pump. On the electure Dr.McDougall shares about a pictures of the whites of the eyes, where the person practicing a rich diet the veins are almost transparent, where when the cleaned up the diet they were vibrant. Hmmm I will have to restudy sclerology and start charting my children's eyes.. where they can pay attention to their children eyes and increase their awareness of their diet and digestive system.

Aloha, patty ... seeing you well and healthy.