Many emailed/passed out copies of Dec. McD newsletter....

S B · **Posted:** Sun Jan 28, 2007 4:05 pm

Did any of you encounter those who do NOT believe that global warming is REAL? Did any of them NOT like the fact that we are trying to encourage people to cut back on the consumption of animal products as a way to help "save the planet"?

If so, what did they say? What do you think will help convince them that global warming IS REAL and/or that cutting back on livestock production will help?

People like this are very difficult to reason with. Suggestions on how to deal with them would be very helpful.

Here is what has happened to me, so far.....

I emailed the link to the newsletter (with a short personal note) to a list of people. Some of them (the ones I thought might be interested) thanked me for sending it. One (who is a member of an organization) said he would discuss this issue with his colleagues to see if they are already doing something or if they would do something about it.....(do not know the results of this, yet). However, those whom I thought would not agree with the articles have NOT emailed back (about this subject), yet. I think THESE FOLKS are trying to AVOID discussing the issues of global warming, livestock production, and health with me!

Also, my husband and I passed out some printed copies of the articles and asked the recipients to read them and then pass them on to someone else -- and so on and so on....... we received a "thank you" from all of those we gave them to BEFORE they read them. We have not had much chance to get into deep conversations with these folks NOW that they HAVE read them and passed them on -- but we have NOT had any bad feedback from them -- so far.....

Actually, I think some of them were a little STUNNED by the articles and did not quite know what to think or say about them!!!

I also snail mailed copies of the articles in a letter to a childhood friend of mine whose family raises beef cattle. They do NOT have one of those HUGE western ranches. They live in the eastern part of the U.S. and have a rather small scale farm -- compared to those out west. (Actually, they used to have dairy cattle and then switched over to beef cattle.) I tried to make the letter very polite and stressed that I was NOT calling ANYONE the "bad guy" but that I sent the articles because they describe how we can help stop global warming -- by cutting livestock production in half. In a previous letter (not long before the newsletter came out), by a WEIRD COINSIDENCE, I had told her how easily we were able to grow Fuyu persimmons (and by judging from their market price in the stores) how profitable we felt it would be for her family to grow and sell them, if they wanted to. This STRANGE first letter made sending her the letter with the articles MUCH easier!

Of course, replacing part of their cattle with persimmon trees might NOT be the right solution for them -- but at least this idea gave them something positive to think about.

I have not received an answer from this friend, yet. (Her mother is very ill, so I do not expect to hear from her real soon.) I hope I did not offend her. I do not think I did, but I still hope I did not...... By the way, I have told her about McDing several times and she admits that I look much better now that I am a McDer -- but she and her family still eat SAD style.

I do NOT expect that my letters will convince her and her family to cut their livestock production by half (or to entirely cut it out) and/or to become McDers. However, I DO think my letters, the articles, the U.N. report ("Livestock's Long Shadow") might leave an impression on her and her family. Then, as more scientific reports about global warming come out, they might think about my letters, the articles, and the U.N. report in conjunction with the "new" reports. Then, PERHAPS, ALL of these TOGETHER might convince her and her family to take some small steps in the right direction.

These things, that my husband and I are doing, are just little steps in the MANY, MANY, MANY steps that I feel are needed to convince people to be a part of the solution to global warming.

I sincerely hope we are doing some good!

Thank you.

libellule · **Posted:** Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:19 pm

I agree with you wholeheartedly, but I am not surprised by people's reactions as you are putting it in their face that their addiction to meat...dairy...the animal food producing industry is a chief cause for global warming. Plus, besides food being an addiction, most are addicted to their consumeristic lifestyle & petroleum addiction.

Anyway, I don't want to start a flame war as I have a hard enough time overcoming my own food addictions regardless that I agree with your views. :oops:

I applaud you for having the courage, tenacity and stamina to stand-up for your convictions.
--Li

AnnaS · **Posted:** Mon Jan 29, 2007 6:33 am

SB, I would guess if your friend is raising cattle on a smaller scale that they probably share a lot of the same concerns about factory farming. They are getting squeezed out by bigger operations that have no scruples. Sometimes smaller farmers are among the most conservation-oriented--they care about the land.

We live in the Midwest and my husband recently wrote an article in an environmental newsletter against ethanol and how it wouldn't be good for the smaller farmer and doesn't make sense energy-wise anyway. He received a VERY grateful response from a small family farmer in the region who read the article. The farmer thanked him profusely for being bold enough to state these things. Otherwise, ethanol is being touted around here as the be-all and end-all.

Anyway, just to say that while your friend may not jump on the vegetarian bandwagon, I'll bet you will find some common ground in your concerns.

hope101 · **Joined:** Mon Oct 30, 2006 1:41 pm **Posts:** 1941

It is so hard to know how to get the information across in a helpful and non-threatening way. My sense of urgency on this issue far exceeds anyone I know, including my DH, so I have to guard against being almost evangelical in how I "spread the news". I would rather work a little slower than alienate people forever, but I do want to be able to discuss a topic that feels very important to me with good friends and family. I took a Master Composter course facilitated by my city last year and networked with other people for whom this is a priority just so I didn't feel so alone.

I used to work in a field where I was always trying to help other's implement lifestyle change. What I learned, through trial and error, was to find out what they valued and help them see the change as moving towards their ultimate dreams. I think this argument needs to be framed the same way. It becomes a way to engage people and call them to their own higher ideal, rather than something that they see as imposed on them.

For example, my sister, who I love dearly, cares about the environment in the abstract, but honestly won't consider it when it comes to chosing what she puts on her dinner plate. But she does care about the health of her family--they are all obese, including her kids, and wanting to make changes. So although I have let her know the statistics about how her food choices influence the planet, I frame the discussion much more about how a meal of beans and rice will be so much better for her family than a chicken burger.

My brother smokes and drives without a seatbelt. He is in his 30's and facing a life on antihypertensives if he doesn't change something fundamental. Someday his health may be a focus for him, but it isn't right now. But he has a compost pile, rainbarrels for water and bikes wherever he can. So I go all out in discussing the environmental impact of his food choices. What is so wonderful is that he happens to be doing his body a favor at the same time.

That's what I love about this issue, and thats what gives me hope. In the same way that the damage we do in one part of the world cascades to create other problems, the solutions too ripple out to create ever-greater realities. We can have a healthy planet, healthy bodies, fewer suffering animals, healthy spirits all by making the same choice at our dinner plate.

As for the people who completely don't believe, I have sent on Dr. McDougall's newsletter or other articles by e-mail over the years with notes like "FYI--thought you might want to be in the loop". Maybe someday they will be ready for dialogue, but now is not the time. There will always be people who don't want to face the current realities because it is inconvenient and some who are convinced global warming is a conspiracy. The former will come around eventually (heck, even our politicians are slowly improving) when change has been made easier for them. The latter are just too afraid or cynical right now to trust anyone on this. I would rather put my time and energy into improving myself (cutting back my driving, researching geothermal, etc.) and talking with people on the cusp of making changes. My hope is a precious comodity and I find hard-line doubters are just too corrosive for my own health.

libellule · **Posted:** Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:19 pm

Oh Hope!
Bravo for your work!! It is very constructive. My husband and I take part in the composting program that our county has. We live so close to the lake and see rats from time to time, so we are more hesitant to use the compost ourselves and keep it. So, we seperate all our food wastes in the bin the city gives us and they take it weekly to use for compost. I am very imprssed with the work that you do. Kudos to all who try!

--Li

hope101 · **Joined:** Mon Oct 30, 2006 1:41 pm **Posts:** 1941

Oh, thank you Li, but I am just a novice to composting. I grew up with it but my husband had such strong objections to composting for years that I just gave in. I was fortunate in that our city composts too, so I didn't feel horrendously guilty about not doing it personally. The course really helped me get over my fears. It feels so good to do it and show my kids how it's done.

Rats would upset me too. We are in a rat-free province, but we do get mice. The advice they gave us at the course is to make sure to keep the heap the moistness of a damp sponge. I guess animals don't tend to use it as a nest then. It is surprising how much moisture it needs to be optimal. If it freezes in the winter where composting can't take place, they advised us to overwater so that it would become an ice block.

There is another option if you garden, which is to basically throw your compostable materials in a trench in your garden, covering it up as you go. You change rows you use every year. That way, no real "pile". If you are interested I can probably dig up some on-line references.

S B · **Posted:** Wed Jan 31, 2007 1:30 pm

Libellule, thank you very much your post. I know what you mean!

Even though I wrote little personal notes as ways to help soften the "in your face" blow of the articles, I am sure some felt like I was personally attacking them.

The next time I email articles I will try HARDER to not be "IN PEOPLES FACES"!

Thanks, again!

S B · **Posted:** Wed Jan 31, 2007 1:45 pm

(I accidently submitted the above post too soon!)

Hope, thank you for sharing your experience!

You said, "I used to work in a field where I was always trying to help other's implement lifestyle change. What I learned, through trial and error, was to find out what they valued and help them see the change as moving towards their ultimate dreams. I think this argument needs to be framed the same way. It becomes a way to engage people and call them to their own higher ideal, rather than something that they see as imposed on them."

From now on, I will try to use this strategy as much as I can!!!

AnnaS, thanks for being encouraging! Yes, my rancher friend DOES care about the environment (to some extent) and, even though we do not agree on everything, we do agree on many things. Thanks, for reminding me of this! You made me feel MUCH better!

Many thanks to both of you!

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