Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

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Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby eXtremE » Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:55 pm

http://www.latimes.com/science/sciencen ... 8786.story

I have personally always thought Marijuana was far safer to use than cigarettes and booze and I still do, despite just hearing this on talk radio. I have never smoked cigarettes except a cigar once in a blue moon, drink seldom and have never smoked pot btw. Still, I think it should be legalized in all states for those who wish to use it.
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby katgirl55 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 11:19 am

The idea we have is of hippies smoking pot at Woodstock and having a great time. The reality is addicts who become obsessive about getting their fix several times per day, and become non-functioning, and if they try to quit they become anxious and agitated. I do not think this is necessarily worse than what happens with alcohol. Some people become alcoholics and others can have a toast at a party and be fine. When I became interested in my health I realized that alcohol and drugs are poisons and my brain and body have to find a way to cope with them if I ingest them. Alcohol causes a rapid heartbeat for me so I rarely have any and when I do it is limited (toast on New Year's). My understanding is that pot does this to some people as well.
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby patty » Thu Apr 24, 2014 11:26 am

First I have to say I didn't listen to radio program. On Huffington Post there was a article that in 5 years they believed it will be legal in all states. What I have witnessed with Medical Marijuana has been amazing. We are like species all species that seek pleasure and avoid pain. We are just getting better at it. I feel it is going to be a real leveling field for the haves and have nots. Knowledge is power but self-knowledge is Self-Empowerment. We reside in the best labs there are. As a species we are maturing from the caterpillar to the butterfly.

Aloha, patty
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby dynodan62 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 11:30 am

eXtremE wrote:http://www.latimes.com/science/sciencenow/la-sci-sn-heart-attack-stroke-marijuana-20140423,0,3208786.story

I have personally always thought Marijuana was far safer to use than cigarettes and booze and I still do, despite just hearing this on talk radio. I have never smoked cigarettes except a cigar once in a blue moon, drink seldom and have never smoked pot btw. Still, I think it should be legalized in all states for those who wish to use it.


Nicotine is likely NOT the major cause of heart attack deaths among cigarette smokers. The thousands of toxic chemicals found in the smoke from ANY burning organic matter will get you in the end if you inhale enough. There are plenty of old studies that show cannibus smoking is actually worse than tobacco. No filter, deeper/longer inhalation, more tar, etc., etc. Some people smoke it constantly throughout the day. How many heart attack deaths could be traced to taking only a couple puffs off a Lucky Strike every few days, I wonder?
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby Gershon » Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:20 pm

Let's look at this quote from the article:

"n the United States, when young and otherwise healthy patients show up in emergency departments with symptoms of heart attack, stroke, cardiomyopathy and cardiac arrhythmia, physicians have frequently noted in case reports that these unusual patients are regular marijuana users."

Well, those that don't show up are frequently regular marijuana users, too.

Look at the last lines:
" "It is the responsibility of the medical community to determine the safety of the drug before it is widely legalized for recreational use."

Why is this true with marijuana and not the many food additives? On one hand, they want to protect the food additive companies, and on the other hand, they want to protect the DEA budget. The medical community almost always supports the rich people, not the average person.
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby GeoffreyLevens » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:06 pm

Gershon wrote:Let's look at this quote from the article:

"In the United States, when young and otherwise healthy patients show up in emergency departments with symptoms of heart attack, stroke, cardiomyopathy and cardiac arrhythmia, physicians have frequently noted in case reports that these unusual patients are regular marijuana users."

Exactly! And this
Notably these complaints often came from patients who were young and had no previous evidence of cardiovascular disease.
No previous "evidence"? That means maybe that they are not in an HMO that tests them and gives them for elevated cholesterol, vascular lesions, beginning blockages? From what I know, the vast majority of teens already have the beginnings of cardiovascular disease, just not diagnosed. Just an example of last dying gasps from the legalization resistance I think.
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby Ginger » Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:41 pm

Whatever health risks marijuana may pose, they pale in comparison to the consequences of incarceration. The "cure" is far worse than the condition it purports to solve. Having worked in corrections, I have seen "up close and personal" the damage done to individuals and their families when drug use and possession bring anyone into the clutches of our barbaric system of "justice".
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby eXtremE » Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:50 pm

I hear the federal government Ginger is trying to get some of those incarcerated released for these low-level drug offenses.

The prison-industrial complex is a huge booming business and it needs prisoners to thrive....sad really!

Long-term Prison sentences for murderers and rapists...yes
MJ users and sellers......no IMO
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby CATIE » Thu Apr 24, 2014 9:38 pm

I voted to legalize marijuana here in Colorado. I was duped. The big sales are the cookies and candies and other sweets used to get THC to people. Kids will, of course, eat the stuff. Adults easily overdose on it because there is a long-ish delay in the response so they eat more candy or cookies or brownies until they feel high. Often 6 - 7 times the recommended "dose".

I don't think kids will accidentally smoke a joint, but they sure will get into the desserts. There is no regulation as to how much THC is in an "edible", or what quality it is.

I'm pretty ignorant about pot. I thought I was voting to let people grow it and smoke it. I didn't know that I was voting to allow people to buy and sell "edibles" that are so dangerous and have caused some very serious side effects in people.

I hope to god that they come up with some way to keep medical marijuana legal - but the edible form of marijuana, disguised in cookies and candies, is a disaster. Health risks way above and beyond what I think is reasonable, and packaged to appeal to everyone - including children! This has GOT to be regulated before more states legalize marijuana.

Sure, smoking pot has health risks, but so does eating at McDonalds.
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby eXtremE » Thu Apr 24, 2014 10:17 pm

Good point Catie. I have heard about the problems with the edibles too and you are right. I agree with what you said about keeping the medical marijuana legal for sick ppl who benefit from it. OTOH, underage kids get a hold of cigarettes and booze too. They just get other ppl (older adults) to buy these things for them.
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby GeoffreyLevens » Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:39 am

The problem w/ edibles is that the effects are quite different from smoking/inhaling vapors. Much longer lasting pain relief etc without the lung damage. So edibles are very desirable medically and marijuana tastes terrible by itself as an extract so people will try to make it taste good. As with anything, at some point we do need to make people responsible for their actions and not try to control every wiggle and pop by law. Stiff penalties for mishandling of edibles if the kids get into them makes much more sense than banning them outright. Making them dose controlled ie one typical dose per package makes good sense as well. There is much to be done besides hand wringing.
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby petero » Fri Apr 25, 2014 10:17 am

There is indeed a potential for heart attack, at least over time. Substances high in saturated fat like butter and coconut oils are used in these "baked" goods because they're better at dissolving the THC. How's that for your endothelial function?

This leaves VLFWFPBWOEers with few alternatives. Vaporization is wasteful but I'm also not so sure it's totally benign. If something isn't soluble in water, how is it being carried on water vapor alone? And if THC precursors require high temperatures (~350F) to convert into THC, why does vaporizing work better than simple ingestion? That really only leaves ethanol extraction. If someone is interested there are plenty of instructions for how to do this online.

Anyway, as a former smoker, there is zero doubt in my mind that I'd rather catch my kids with a joint or a pot brownie rather than a tobacco cigarette, an extremely addictive stimulant with no redeeming value, that will eventually cause your death or disability, yet that remains legal. Of course, comparisons like this merely highlight societal hypocrisy and the power of money and prejudice.

Also, having been a kid, I don't think that products containing THC are going to appeal to kids just because they're shaped like lollipops or taste like brownies. Products containing THC appeal to people of all ages because they contain THC. Nobody consumes them for any other reason. Those products need to be kept in the right hands like all products intended for adult use, using means other than appearance.

I wish I lived in WA or CO... :crybaby: I only wish that they would pass laws that bar the entry of large corporations into the market, and limit the size of MJ-related enterprises so that lower income people and small businesses could reap most of the economic benefits of legalization.
It's easy to be a naive idealist. It's easy to be a cynical realist. It's quite another thing to have no illusions and still hold the inner flame. -- Marie-Louise von Franz
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby Demosthenes » Fri Apr 25, 2014 10:25 am

petero wrote:This leaves VLFWFPBWOEers with few alternatives. Vaporization is wasteful but I'm also not so sure it's totally benign. If something isn't soluble in water, how is it being carried on water vapor alone? And if THC precursors require high temperatures (~350F) to convert into THC, why does vaporizing work better than simple ingestion? That really only leaves ethanol extraction. If someone is interested there are plenty of instructions for how to do this online.


The THC isn't being carried by water. Vaporization is simply the phase change. THC becomes gaseous at a certain temperature, one lower than required for the combustion of the plant materials. Vaporizing works better than ingestion because the gas readily passes through the lungs into the blood stream very quickly. When stems and leaves are ingested (and not THC dissolved in fat) they take longer to be absorbed and also aren't absorbed as completely because of all that fiber.

I honestly think you're better off not partaking in the stuff. I used to smoke a lot of pot and it ultimately left me with lots of upper respiratory infections and chronic depression. It really does affect your short term memory and cognition.
"Rice is great if you're really hungry and want to eat 2,000 of something."- Mitch Hedberg
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby patty » Fri Apr 25, 2014 10:41 am

In the islands medical marijuana has been legal for about 10 years, but there are no dispensaries. The person/or caregiver are allowed to have 6 plants, but again it is up to them to get the seeds. People are creative enough to find someone who has plants etc. And medical marijuana can be brought in from states that have dispensers. I have seen the candy and pill form. And of course the cookies. The families monitor and have complete control as the doctors who have given them the medical card are not involved. It is a interesting process because it is a life death situation and a tremendous about of TLC from the families is given. The side effects are nothing like the harsh chemicals that are prescribed. Of course it is a temporary fix and the families know that and monitor accordingly.

A friend was sharing about Georgia's Governor passing a gun law that permits guns can be carried by private citizens. At the same time they denied medical marijuana. Amazing the country we live in.

Aloha, patty

The amount of the cookie that is given is say about the size of a dime. And it is a incredible amount cheaper then the co-pay prescribed drugs,
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Re: Marijuana, Potential for heart attack

Postby katgirl55 » Fri Apr 25, 2014 10:50 am

Amazing that people do not get it. Pot is not the panacea it is being marketed as. If you want to partake, so be it, and I will defend your right by voting for legalization if it comes to that. I am sick of the hipocrisy of keeping this illegal while alcohol is sold everywhere. I am also a proponent of hemp as a renewable resource which is hindered by the current anti-marijuana laws. But please be aware that there are health concerns with ingesting any substance, including marijuana. The THC itself has been found to raise heart rate, so it does not matter if it is eaten in a brownie or smoked or vaped. Please take the daisies out of your eyes, folks. :duh:
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